But that said, I remain highly discomforted about raising other drugs to the level that tobacco and alcohol enjoy. I understand the whole "it's hypocritical" argument except, if it were up to me, I'd be all for going the other way and banning alcohol and tobacco. That's just on some private mind garden level though. I'm not actually advocating for a return to Prohibition. But I think they're destructive social forces, whether legal or illegal.
sadly i cant vote on it as i am not in the US, but...
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
mannybolone said:
But that said, I remain highly discomforted about raising other drugs to the level that tobacco and alcohol enjoy.
Do tobacco and alcohol really enjoy their status? They are filled with cancerous herbicides and pesticides and preservatives that are far worse for you than their active agents themselves. They are overtaxed and regulated by the worst Billy Bob cops to have ever walked the planet. As a dedicated weed smoker, I would never wish such a status upon my green friend. Make the severe punishments go away. But please do not leave it to the state to do anything but breathe our secondary smoke.
dollar_binI heartily endorse this product and/or event 2,326 Posts
It must be important, Robot Susan Sarandon has called my house three times in the last 24 hours.
But that said, I remain highly discomforted about raising other drugs to the level that tobacco and alcohol enjoy.
Do tobacco and alcohol really enjoy their status? They are filled with cancerous herbicides and pesticides and preservatives that are far worse for you than their active agents themselves. They are overtaxed and regulated by the worst Billy Bob cops to have ever walked the planet. As a dedicated weed smoker, I would never wish such a status upon my green friend. Make the severe punishments go away. But please do not leave it to the state to do anything but breathe our secondary smoke.
that and when was the last time you saw tobacco or alcohol being prescribed to a cancer patient who cant keep food down due to intense chemotherapy, i endorse this shit as a smoker and my brother has (CML) Chronic Myelogenous Leukemia, the interferon that he was on did wicked things to his insides and it wasnt until he started smoking that he was able to make the pain subside and be able to eat again..
A proposition like 19 needs another year or two of solid research behind it. Revenue generated from excise taxes and fees can easily be misappropriated. I don't necessarily disagree with the premise of 19, but as with any tax-related initiative, I need to know that there are no loose ends before I vote for it. I'm still unclear about the implications regarding commercial cultivation. You can grow it for your own personal use in a max of 25 sq feet, but what about commercial cultivation? Who will set up the cultivation standards? How will marijuana as a cash crop work? In a state that relies heavily on the agricultural sector of the economy, I don't feel that this has been addressed thoroughly.
Come on now, Almond. If you could never vote for anything unless you were sure no tax dollars would be misappropriated, you would never vote for anything -- too much fine print, too many pages in each piece of legislation. It's sad but true.
Man, if young kids like Almond are on the 'no' bandwagon this measure will never pass.
A 'no' on prop 19 means you are down with the way things are now, not even giving change a chance. I guess at least we are having a conversation about legalization and it made it onto the ballot, baby steps, yawn.
A proposition like 19 needs another year or two of solid research behind it. Revenue generated from excise taxes and fees can easily be misappropriated. I don't necessarily disagree with the premise of 19, but as with any tax-related initiative, I need to know that there are no loose ends before I vote for it. I'm still unclear about the implications regarding commercial cultivation. You can grow it for your own personal use in a max of 25 sq feet, but what about commercial cultivation? Who will set up the cultivation standards? How will marijuana as a cash crop work? In a state that relies heavily on the agricultural sector of the economy, I don't feel that this has been addressed thoroughly.
Which comes back to the question of who should have addressed this and in which forum (public, I mean). Seriously, I've been watching a ton of TV b/c of baseball and other shows and I can't remember seeing a single "Yes on 19" ad pop up. I can understand the challenges presented there (it's the same reason the No on 8 ads were so tepid) but I felt like they ceded public ground to a very vocal opposition.
I feel like the mainstream media was also complicit here; the slant I saw in coverage tended to be far more skeptical than supportive.
But like Garcia Vega said, I think, in the long run, we'll see either decriminalization or legalization happen. And despite my (maligned) reservations, if given the opportunity, I'd still vote in favor just for the sake of seeing some new direction on the issue.
Come on now, Almond. If you could never vote for anything unless you were sure no tax dollars would be misappropriated, you would never vote for anything -- too much fine print, too many pages in each piece of legislation. It's sad but true.
Of course we can't predict how tax dollars will be spent, but what I'm saying is that I think the proposition needs more time put into it. I agree with 19 in general, but don't think it's ready yet.
I just kinda figured it was gonna pass. Everybody I know, smokers and non, are voting yes. But then I do live in a city where the city counsel threatened to get new law enforcement if the Sheriffs didn't lay off the busts.
The irony is all the dudes I know who are really really for this don't have their shit together enough to be registered voters and aren't trying to rectify that - and that's just based on things I see around me.
Not only is this not ironic, I think its one reason a lot of people will be joking about why this didn't pass...
I just kinda figured it was gonna pass. Everybody I know, smokers and non, are voting yes. But then I do live in a city where the city counsel threatened to get new law enforcement if the Sheriffs didn't lay off the busts.
Based on the results coming in, Nor Cal went for this but L.A. came up shorter than many had predicted/hoped. KPCC had Jim Gray on (this guy: http://www.judgejimgray.com/whyourdruglawshavefailed.php) who was a Prop 19 proponent but in 20/20 hindsight, he thinks it was a poorly written proposition that confused voters and probably shot itself in the foot but he also thinks, in the next 2-4 years, a similar (and presumably better written) proposition will pass.
I just woke up to two full clips of gunshots outside my window. A somewhat regular occurrence. Save that poorly written shit for the breathing. Stick up my ass indeed.
Not surprising. I sense that reporters are going to have a field day with their cutesy "19 goes up in smoke", "pipe dream", "supporters were too high to remember to vote", etc pot puns :eyeroll:
Not surprising. I sense that reporters are going to have a field day with their cutesy "19 goes up in smoke", "pipe dream", "supporters were too high to remember to vote", etc pot puns :eyeroll:
The press coverage leading up (and after! has been uniformly snickering. Embarassingly so.
Comments
I was referring to this post:
Never said I was. What's with the strawnen today?
Is this as absurd as "You can't make psychedelic music unless you drop acid"?
you also can't talk about jazz until you've shot heroin at least once
What must I do to discuss disco?
:pasue:
Do tobacco and alcohol really enjoy their status? They are filled with cancerous herbicides and pesticides and preservatives that are far worse for you than their active agents themselves. They are overtaxed and regulated by the worst Billy Bob cops to have ever walked the planet. As a dedicated weed smoker, I would never wish such a status upon my green friend. Make the severe punishments go away. But please do not leave it to the state to do anything but breathe our secondary smoke.
that and when was the last time you saw tobacco or alcohol being prescribed to a cancer patient who cant keep food down due to intense chemotherapy, i endorse this shit as a smoker and my brother has (CML) Chronic Myelogenous Leukemia, the interferon that he was on did wicked things to his insides and it wasnt until he started smoking that he was able to make the pain subside and be able to eat again..
A 'no' on prop 19 means you are down with the way things are now, not even giving change a chance. I guess at least we are having a conversation about legalization and it made it onto the ballot, baby steps, yawn.
Hic...
Which comes back to the question of who should have addressed this and in which forum (public, I mean). Seriously, I've been watching a ton of TV b/c of baseball and other shows and I can't remember seeing a single "Yes on 19" ad pop up. I can understand the challenges presented there (it's the same reason the No on 8 ads were so tepid) but I felt like they ceded public ground to a very vocal opposition.
I feel like the mainstream media was also complicit here; the slant I saw in coverage tended to be far more skeptical than supportive.
But like Garcia Vega said, I think, in the long run, we'll see either decriminalization or legalization happen. And despite my (maligned) reservations, if given the opportunity, I'd still vote in favor just for the sake of seeing some new direction on the issue.
See, if only I had the sexy, soothing, roboticized voice of Sarandon calling me, maybe I wouldn't have been as ambivalent.
Of course we can't predict how tax dollars will be spent, but what I'm saying is that I think the proposition needs more time put into it. I agree with 19 in general, but don't think it's ready yet.
Living in Hong Kong way back when was awesome for this reason, but sadly this is barely an option in this day and age - at least on the East Coast.
Not only is this not ironic, I think its one reason a lot of people will be joking about why this didn't pass...
Based on the results coming in, Nor Cal went for this but L.A. came up shorter than many had predicted/hoped. KPCC had Jim Gray on (this guy: http://www.judgejimgray.com/whyourdruglawshavefailed.php) who was a Prop 19 proponent but in 20/20 hindsight, he thinks it was a poorly written proposition that confused voters and probably shot itself in the foot but he also thinks, in the next 2-4 years, a similar (and presumably better written) proposition will pass.
Agreed. Nothing makes a person feel lower than relying on California to fight their battles for them... ;-)
The press coverage leading up (and after! has been uniformly snickering. Embarassingly so.