Question for music industry dudes
minneap
541 Posts
I'm taking a music business class from some dickhead that was hardly legit in the 80s so you can imagine how off point he is now. While discussing publishing rights and where money goes I brought up hip-hop and he had no clue. Does publishing money go to the producer? Rapper? Record co? If a dude like Edan raps and produces does he keep everything?Hopefully 
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plus, for a teacher to not be able to talk about rap/hihphop after 30yrs of records being made, especially when urban/black music is one of the forerunners of music today, really shows what dude/tte knows.
It's pretty much the same as any other form of music. It's all in how the artists/label/publishing company decides to split it. If some dude wrote the music and lyrics for a song he'd probably keep all of the publishing, even if his buddy slapped a mean bass on it.
If it's a major label thing, where the group has a publishing deal, then the publishing company will take a portion of it. basically they do work for you, trying to place the songs in certain places and doing all the paper work involved.
If it's just some indie dude who does it all himself and puts the stuff out himself than he'd keep it all. In that case you need to be your own publisher, which you can do, you just make another account.
There is no separate category for hip hop when registering songs. It's just all in how people decide who gets credit for writing what. Same as with any band.
Fairybelle: After my first "industry" course, I realized that those classes weren't going to get me anywhere except on stage to grab a piece of paper and fist pump towards the crowd Breakfast Club style. I got a (pending) internship at Rhymesayers this summer and a probable internship at a studio for next semester. Definitely tryin to build up the resume and contact list before I graduate.
first off artist royalties are a percentage of actual sales. there are different rates for level of artist (superstars usually have higher rates because they sell more records)...
the publishing can go numerous ways. for your example most likely Edan will keep 100% unless there are some sample issues. but i mean with Edan he is most likely not getting clearance on obscure funk breaks etc...
most situations it is a writer and producer. like Too Short and Ant Banks 50/50
in some cases its a 4 way split. on a Britney Spears song she may have 2 co-writers and the Neptunes might produced it. Britney keeps 25%. cowriters 50% and the other 25% to Neptunes and then its split between Chad and Pharell i guess
sometimes artists dont write shit and its all outside writers...
sometimes (and yes i have seen this) itll be lets say 50% for Too Short...45% for Ant Banks. and 5% for a D. Brown
who is D Brown? why does he get 5%? Ant think he gets 50%. well D. Brown was the guy who brought the weed to the studio!! imagine how hard it is to track a weed guy down? but since he probably wont come for his money we give 50% to Ant
there are a lot of disputes. they may have split it evenly but after label changes and fights between group members and rappers (they fight a lot) we have a problem confirming publishing splits
most of the time when artists sit down to sign contracts and they have a local guest rapper who wrote a verse and gets a percentage they ask what his pub company is and they make up a name on the spot
so you can imagine it being pretty hard to get a hold of Desk and Chair Rap Productions (again yes that name is real)
its a weird world
sometimes writers wont be there to put their name on the track and they come out 20 yrs later claiming they wrote the song....
i can keep going and going
usually its based on the amount of people though and their involvement!
it is harder in the rap world because you have writers and producers. and these producers use samples. these samples might be by a group whose members were fighting over ownership on their own material. you might have to pay out sample clearance to 2 owners....
ive noticed live bands it is way easier
i never have a problem with Bullet For My Valentine
T-Pain though?
its a hassle
another aspect is mechanical royalties. depending on an artists deal, they get a percentage of sales that has nothing to do with the publishing, its just "record co gives X per sold album to artist". this tends to be like .10 to .25 cents a copy. (if a group, they then split that $ as many ways as are members officially in the group thats on the contract.)
totally separate from that is the aforementioned publishing royalties, which Behemoth succinctly guided us thru above.
many bands have internal grief when they do not split the publishing equally between members. say one dude wrote all the songs and says well the publishing is mine, you guys are cool but you didnt help me write the songs and i dont feel like sharing. Ok so say then the album sells good. well, they all split the mechanicals, (which first must go to pay back any advance they've took from the label), but meanwhile the writer gets all the publishing (or if he has a publishing deal, he already got an advance from the pub co. which he is in turn paying off separately). considering that publishing is usually much more total per album than mechanicals, you can see how the non-writers who dont have a share of the publishing royalties can get steamed at the writer. (be it rap, rock, etc)
for example. say mechanicals per album are .20/record and say publishing comes in at 1.00/record. say the writer (wisely) didnt sell his publishing rights. now say they sell 1 million copies (haha pretend its 1990 ok). say they have to pay back a recording budget of $250,000 (not big by '90s standards) Ok so, who has $? not the other dudes, theyre all still in debt. theve made 5 cents per album (x 1 mil = 50k) each, but thats all gone back to paying off the advance, and so the band is collectively still in the hole $50K. But meanwhile the writer is already a millionaire. he got $1 per record, no advance to pay back (or if he took a publishing advance, hes paid it back already most likely).
...all this is another reason why merch and touring is a big deal for a band/act if they want to clear bank. (note the double whammy: if the above band situation happens, whos least likely to be motivated to tour and make additional $? why its that already-a-millionaire writer. meanwhile the other 3 dudes are like "goddamn we need to get on the damn road and sell some tshirts and tickets!"
It's amazing how messed up the whole music industry.
The above is why I think guys like McGuinn and Fogarty are such a-holes for not letting their former band mates tour.
Whats the normal deal in the 'real' industry with DJs? If they drop cuts on a record do they get credit for that?
Also, a good book to trackdown it "When the writ hits the fan" by Phillip Tripp whos an aussie music biz lawyer. He gets very candid in the book and talks about major acts legal issues around shit like publishing, a pretty honest insider look...
http://www.amazon.com/Business-Marketing-Promotion-Revised-Updated/dp/0823077292
Any suggestions, Quo?
Bookwise I have no clue. As stated above one of the only ways is to get your hands dirty in the biz.
Very loosely related (and recently published) I would suggest Appetite for Self Destruction. Quick interesting view of the Industry's history from 1979 to now.
I understand the business pretty well, but it would be nice to have a good reference book.
Peace