Wanted: San Francisco TKO's "Acid Lady" on Ode

SurrealistSurrealist 218 Posts
edited February 2008 in Vinyl Wants / Trades
Does anyone have any idea of how much this record usually sells for, and are there any Aussies or NZ peeps who would be willing to ship to US?? The reason I ask is this was a NZ-only pressing and I'm assuming most copies are remained in that part of the world...I don't want a reissue or comp either...

  Comments


  • Bro... if only there were copies floating around down here. Those TKO rekkids are few and far between in this neck of the woods... not to mention sweated on by local collectros

  • addendum: does anyone know how to reach John Idem, whom I believe had a copy for sale or trade?? I need a best contact for him, as I've tried sending email to his website but I'm not sure if the site is updated regularly...btw, I'm a chic, hahaha....and thanks for your input...I do have "Make Up Your Mind" by the San Francisco TKO's which is in a completely different style, but right now I am addicted to the "Acid Lady" song...

  • KineticKinetic 3,739 Posts
    Throw a figure at me on the PM and I might consider selling mine.

  • Yes!!! I don't know the exact value, but I know how rare it is...just sent you a PM....THANK YOU!!!!

  • lambertlambert 1,166 Posts
    I have no business being in this thread but wtf? I always thought this was a wast coast record. What is the NZ connection, if no one minds me asking?

  • jinx74jinx74 2,287 Posts
    the guy who ran the studio that the TKOs recorded at licensed a bunch of rock stuff to the Ode label owner. we found multiple reels that had various artists that the label (golden state recorders, golden soul, golden gate gospel, etc) would send out to other labels/distributors to try and make that extra dough. dont know the full story as to why Ode decided to release herm/acid lady but it does fit in with their rock stuff.

    i know john wanted like $600 or some shit a year or so back. i think $250-300 would be fair but then again i havent dealt with records for well over a year or two and dont know the going rate.

  • I have no business being in this thread but wtf? I always thought this was a wast coast record. What is the NZ connection, if no one minds me asking?

    To answer the question, in spirit it is definitely a West Coast record, but was only released in New Zealand. NZ comes into the picture courtesy the fact Ode Records HQ are in Auckland, NZ. If I'm not mistaken, the record was released in either 1973 or 1974 with "Herm" on the other side. In keeping with what someone else mentioned, my copy of "Make up Your Mind" lists Golden State as the record label. However, until now, apparently, this record had never been released. I talked to DJ Shadow at a record convention and he said he bought his copy of "Acid Lady" from a private dealer here, but I figured it would be a lot easier to get a copy from someone in NZ or Australia for the reason I gave above. And I think there may be a TKO's LP but have never actually seen a copy...

    JINX, DO YOU HAVE A COPY FOR SALE OR KNOW SOMEONE WHO DOES???

  • jinx74jinx74 2,287 Posts
    I have no business being in this thread but wtf? I always thought this was a wast coast record. What is the NZ connection, if no one minds me asking?

    To answer the question, in spirit it is definitely a West Coast record, but was only released in New Zealand. NZ comes into the picture courtesy the fact Ode Records HQ are in Auckland, NZ. If I'm not mistaken, the record was released in either 1973 or 1974 with "Herm" on the other side. In keeping with what someone else mentioned, my copy of "Make up Your Mind" lists Golden State as the record label. However, until now, apparently, this record had never been released. I talked to DJ Shadow at a record convention and he said he bought his copy of "Acid Lady" from a private dealer here, but I figured it would be a lot easier to get a copy from someone in NZ or Australia for the reason I gave above. And I think there may be a TKO's LP but have never actually seen a copy...

    JINX, DO YOU HAVE A COPY FOR SALE OR KNOW SOMEONE WHO DOES???

    yes Acid Lady was only released on Ode but Herm was also released here with Ooh Baby Baby as the flip. Josh actually has an acetate of Acid Lady and, i think, Make Up Your Mind on the flip. also that pink label TKOs record is a boot and was never officially released. someone mentioned to me who booted it but i cant remember. great track though. Ace/Kent who own the masters to this stuff released a couple of their tracks on a Golden State Recorders comp a few years back.

    73 might be a little late actually. more like 69/70 if i remember what herm told me correctly. they wanted to do a santana-ish type groove and came up with AL. "Herm" was the bands warm up track that they did before performances.

    They never recorded a full LP but did record a few Sly tunes (since a few of the members were from Slys band originally). i have 7 tracks from them including the two 45s and make up your mind with three Sly covers. all recorded by Leo Kulka.

    i dont have an extra nor do i know anyone with an extra to move. good luck with that one!

  • spelunkspelunk 3,400 Posts

  • shitzrshitzr 648 Posts
    also that pink label TKOs record is a boot and was never officially released. someone mentioned to me who booted it but i cant remember. great track though.

    i forget if someone said that he booted them, but rosen in vegas has a gaaaaaang of them.

  • I have no business being in this thread but wtf? I always thought this was a wast coast record. What is the NZ connection, if no one minds me asking?

    To answer the question, in spirit it is definitely a West Coast record, but was only released in New Zealand. NZ comes into the picture courtesy the fact Ode Records HQ are in Auckland, NZ. If I'm not mistaken, the record was released in either 1973 or 1974 with "Herm" on the other side. In keeping with what someone else mentioned, my copy of "Make up Your Mind" lists Golden State as the record label. However, until now, apparently, this record had never been released. I talked to DJ Shadow at a record convention and he said he bought his copy of "Acid Lady" from a private dealer here, but I figured it would be a lot easier to get a copy from someone in NZ or Australia for the reason I gave above. And I think there may be a TKO's LP but have never actually seen a copy...

    JINX, DO YOU HAVE A COPY FOR SALE OR KNOW SOMEONE WHO DOES???

    yes Acid Lady was only released on Ode but Herm was also released here with Ooh Baby Baby as the flip. Josh actually has an acetate of Acid Lady and, i think, Make Up Your Mind on the flip. also that pink label TKOs record is a boot and was never officially released. someone mentioned to me who booted it but i cant remember. great track though. Ace/Kent who own the masters to this stuff released a couple of their tracks on a Golden State Recorders comp a few years back.

    73 might be a little late actually. more like 69/70 if i remember what herm told me correctly. they wanted to do a santana-ish type groove and came up with AL. "Herm" was the bands warm up track that they did before performances.

    They never recorded a full LP but did record a few Sly tunes (since a few of the members were from Slys band originally). i have 7 tracks from them including the two 45s and make up your mind with three Sly covers. all recorded by Leo Kulka.

    i dont have an extra nor do i know anyone with an extra to move. good luck with that one!

    Actually, per Luv N' Haight info (Luv did the Bay Area Funk compilation) the record was, as I originally stated, released in 1973. I was strictly referring to release date, not the date it was originally recorded (and it definitely doesn't sound like anything from that time period anyway)..of course it probably was recorded in the late 60s but the Ode release hit the streets in NZ some time in '73..

    In reference to your mention of "Herm" (which I think is a great instrumental by the way), I'm not really as fixated with it as I am with the more dancefloor-oriented AL. Herm is much more mellow of course and would also obviously be the much easier find since it was on both 45s. When Josh and I talked about AL it was kind of in the greater context of Bay Area soul and funk...he also mentioned The Turnarounds...and, personally I am interested in finding out more about Sisters of the Ghetto and other such groups

    An LP does exist, it's just that I have never seen a copy of it for sale anywhere. It may not have been a seamless studio album as you suggest, but it could possibly be something akin to a best of...who knows?

    I knew the "Make Up Your Mind" record was never officially released as I previously stated, I was just mentioning how it is, stylistically speaking, nothing like AL...no big deal here, and I think this is just proof the TKO's, in all their incarnations, were an amazing band...I knew most of the cool anecdotes, like the one about the 12 year old drummer, and the Sly & Family Stone angle, and the life and times of Herm...Actually, I hope someone writes an article about this group because I consider it to be one of my favorite funk groups!

    I got that "Make Up Your Mind" boot from a UK-based ebay seller for 12.99, hahaha...

    Anyways, I first found out about AL from reading a Cut Chemist setlist over at the Jazzman podcast page...I'm actually not too worried about whether or not I can get a copy of AL because if either Idem or the other person are willing to sell (and I know Idem probably is if he even still has it) I am definitely buying!!!

    And by the way, I can only imagine what an acetate of this would cost!

  • also that pink label TKOs record is a boot and was never officially released. someone mentioned to me who booted it but i cant remember. great track though.

    i forget if someone said that he booted them, but rosen in vegas has a gaaaaaang of them.
    I knew someone in Vegas had a lot of copies..someone selling under the name of Mischino on the Bay has auctioned several copies, but I bought mine from a UK seller. I don't have any details about who booted Make Up Your Mind, but I think the person who did it obviously wanted to replicate the look of a Golden State 45...I've seen a lot of original yellow label Golden State 45s (some of the gospel ones especially), and obviously this was put out so people could be able to claim they have a TKO's 45. Also, I think it was released because both sides sound great. That is the bottom line for me.

  • Jinx, if Herm himself told you there is no album then I would have to stand corrected, hahaha...You know if an album actually existed it would be superfresh...I guess I can file the info on the LP under Bay Area funk and soul urban legends : )

  • Davis got his copy from me. The Ode pressing states ???73 but obviously Acid Lady was recorded several years before Herm. '68/'69 is the likely period.

    Be warned, it???s very flat when played out, if that???s your intention.

  • djsheepdjsheep 3,620 Posts
    the guy who ran the studio that the TKOs recorded at licensed a bunch of rock stuff to the Ode label owner. we found multiple reels that had various artists that the label (golden state recorders, golden soul, golden gate gospel, etc) would send out to other labels/distributors to try and make that extra dough. dont know the full story as to why Ode decided to release herm/acid lady but it does fit in with their rock stuff.

    i know john wanted like $600 or some shit a year or so back. i think $250-300 would be fair but then again i havent dealt with records for well over a year or two and dont know the going rate.

    I saw the Herm, US pressing on eBay for just a little over a bill a month ago.... I forgot to bid on it, I think Kinetic won it?

    The NZ pressing never turns up, when it does, it's consistently $200-$250 in crispy condition

    b

  • jinx74jinx74 2,287 Posts
    well i have the studio recording sheets at home from the session so ill have to double check when it was recorded. i worked on both bay area funk comps for ubiquity (and my copy of the record is what you hear on the comp) so maybe what they wrote is correct. i really cant remember but will check when i get home tonight from work.

    im positive that the TKOs never released anything more than the one golden soul 45. Herm didnt even know that the Ode record existed until i brought it to him to see. i actually got my copy of the TKOs recorded tunes from Herm and know for sure these are the only tracks they recorded. while Herm ran the band through the mid 60s into the early 70s, he took a break to become the program director of KSOL so id be surprised if the recordings came out in 72/73 but like i said earlier i really cant remember.

    regardless, they were a badass band!

  • well i have the studio recording sheets at home from the session so ill have to double check when it was recorded. i worked on both bay area funk comps for ubiquity (and my copy of the record is what you hear on the comp) so maybe what they wrote is correct. i really cant remember but will check when i get home tonight from work.

    im positive that the TKOs never released anything more than the one golden soul 45. Herm didnt even know that the Ode record existed until i brought it to him to see. i actually got my copy of the TKOs recorded tunes from Herm and know for sure these are the only tracks they recorded. while Herm ran the band through the mid 60s into the early 70s, he took a break to become the program director of KSOL so id be surprised if the recordings came out in 72/73 but like i said earlier i really cant remember.

    regardless, they were a badass band!
    Hey Jinx...great job on those compilations...amazing, high quality music! Thanks for the info about Herm too...is he still over at KSOL?...It's really sad but not uncommon to see musicians or producers who don't even own copies of some of their own music...I hope to just give him a copy one day if I can find more than one out here...right off the top of my head, the Windjammers are another group I really liked from those compilations...again, thanks for your information! Can you go into more detail about the link between Sly and the Family Stone and the TKO's...Members of the Family Stone were session players for the TKO's or did they jump ship or were they going back and forth between the two groups?

  • jinx74jinx74 2,287 Posts

    Can you go into more detail about the link between Sly and the Family Stone and the TKO's...Members of the Family Stone were session players for the TKO's or did they jump ship or were they going back and forth between the two groups?

    some of the members from the TKOs had originaly started out in slys brothers group the the Stone Souls (ted wysinger is the only name i can remember w/o notes in front of me). they also did some back up band work with sly before he got signed to Epic. when he did sign, he dumped most of the band and picked up those that you see on his 1st lp from Epic. those that got dropped from the crew went on to work with the TKOs and marvin holmes' Uptights band.

    sly was really copying his music and outfit style from Leon Patillo (leons creation) and groups like the TKOs who did the mixed band thing really early on (chinese, black, and white musicians). id say half the musicians that ive spoken to in the bay dislike sly.


  • Can you go into more detail about the link between Sly and the Family Stone and the TKO's...Members of the Family Stone were session players for the TKO's or did they jump ship or were they going back and forth between the two groups?

    some of the members from the TKOs had originaly started out in slys brothers group the the Stone Souls (ted wysinger is the only name i can remember w/o notes in front of me). they also did some back up band work with sly before he got signed to Epic. when he did sign, he dumped most of the band and picked up those that you see on his 1st lp from Epic. those that got dropped from the crew went on to work with the TKOs and marvin holmes' Uptights band.

    sly was really copying his music and outfit style from Leon Patillo (leons creation) and groups like the TKOs who did the mixed band thing really early on (chinese, black, and white musicians). id say half the musicians that ive spoken to in the bay dislike sly.
    that's wild...on another note, I was listening to Project Soul's "Ebony" and it just occurred to me I had already read that cool story about the search for this holy grail 45...actually, I had forgotten how rare this record was until I went to Popsike to see how much people were paying for a lot of the Bay Area funk records. And I didn't realize Project Soul morphed into ConFunkShun - that is great to know!..were the Primevil and Dawn and Sunset songs ever released as 45s back in the day?...And is it just me or do the Windjammers sound like the West Coast's answer to The Caprells?

  • KineticKinetic 3,739 Posts
    the guy who ran the studio that the TKOs recorded at licensed a bunch of rock stuff to the Ode label owner. we found multiple reels that had various artists that the label (golden state recorders, golden soul, golden gate gospel, etc) would send out to other labels/distributors to try and make that extra dough. dont know the full story as to why Ode decided to release herm/acid lady but it does fit in with their rock stuff.

    i know john wanted like $600 or some shit a year or so back. i think $250-300 would be fair but then again i havent dealt with records for well over a year or two and dont know the going rate.

    I saw the Herm, US pressing on eBay for just a little over a bill a month ago.... I forgot to bid on it, I think Kinetic won it?

    The NZ pressing never turns up, when it does, it's consistently $200-$250 in crispy condition

    b
    Nah I didn't win it. For the record, Sheep's on the money with the value even over here. I know that back in the 90s, an Aussie dealer based here in Sydney sourced around 30 copies of the Ode 45 from a trip to NZ and sold them here for around $30 each. I know a few people that acquired copies from him back in the day. These days though, it just never turns up. I think I'm gonna hold onto my copy for now. I don't think I'd let it go unless someone offered me stupid money for it.

  • Yeah, I know it never turns up. I've had it saved on Ebay as a search for over 6 months, and still nothing. Maybe when I travel in your neck of the woods I will finally find a copy. Who knows...

  • djsheepdjsheep 3,620 Posts
    Yeah, I know it never turns up. I've had it saved on Ebay as a search for over 6 months, and still nothing. Maybe when I travel in your neck of the woods I will finally find a copy. Who knows...

    No records in Australia (seriously)

  • BreakSelfBreakSelf 2,925 Posts
    ...were the Primevil and Dawn and Sunset songs ever released as 45s back in the day?

    yes

  • holmesholmes 3,532 Posts
    My friend Alan has a copy, he is definitely willing to part with it, for a considerable price (keep in mind it never turns up here in Auckland these days). Jinx was unsuccessful but that was not Jinx's fault, hopefully there are no hard feelings. I am real hesitant to pass on any more contacts to Alan about this record as the last Strutter I referred to him (not Jinx) agreed on a price to complete the transaction & then dicked him around so much that the deal never went through. Not a good look. Cool 45, the sort of thing that local Ode collectros will be sitting on & have no idea that it's sought after. I think Alan said he pulled his clean ex-radio copy out of Real Groovy for $3 a few years back.

  • My friend Alan has a copy, he is definitely willing to part with it, for a considerable price (keep in mind it never turns up here in Auckland these days). Jinx was unsuccessful but that was not Jinx's fault, hopefully there are no hard feelings. I am real hesitant to pass on any more contacts to Alan about this record as the last Strutter I referred to him (not Jinx) agreed on a price to complete the transaction & then dicked him around so much that the deal never went through. Not a good look. Cool 45, the sort of thing that local Ode collectros will be sitting on & have no idea that it's sought after. I think Alan said he pulled his clean ex-radio copy out of Real Groovy for $3 a few years back.
    thank you, i'm sending you a pm...

  • Seriously, who has it for sale?...That was the point of this whole thread...it's cool if someone you know has it, but I am definitely interested in buying it...for real...

  • jinx74jinx74 2,287 Posts
    you shoulda wrote:

    Surrealistly, who has it for sale?

    surrealistly though... have you tried the brit boards? you might have a good chance hollerin on fryers or soulsource.

    good luck!

  • you shoulda wrote:

    Surrealistly, who has it for sale?

    surrealistly though... have you tried the brit boards? you might have a good chance hollerin on fryers or soulsource.

    good luck!
    hahaha, yeah I tried Fryer Mantis...I need to go check soulsource out...thanks for the tip...I've been on Ebay Australia and Ebay New Zealand too...and when I ever make it out to Auckland, hopefully someone will have it in a fleamarket box...

  • you shoulda wrote:

    Surrealistly, who has it for sale?

    surrealistly though... have you tried the brit boards? you might have a good chance hollerin on fryers or soulsource.

    good luck!
    Jinx, I missed that Primevil - Stop Look Listen by one dollar...I walked away from the auction because I was at work and couldn't watch it...so I placed my max bid for 80...still no dice, hahaha...craig moerer was selling it
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