So wait - let me just get this right...according to people at Def Jam, the only reason why Jay-Z recorded "Kingdom Come" was b/c Budweiser gave him money to do it?
Only reason? No... main motivating factor? Yes.
From what I understand, Jay's need to rescue his label from tanking after a series of flops would be a far more compelling reason than b/c Bud threw some money at him. In any case, the Budweiser angle isn't what I'd call a "fact" since the latter would assume that it's information everyone is aware of. I'm pretty sure no one - including at Def Jam - is making it public knowledge, "yeah, Jay cut this album b/c Budweiser gave him x-amount of dollars to do it."
Jay is obsessed with his legacy--Budweiser couldn't possibly offer him enough money to put out an album that he didn't want to put out.
If he were that obsessed with his legacy then he would have put out a dope album, not this mediocre terd.
Also I think that the main reason he even dropped an album is because he has been pretty lackluster in his role at Def Jam. Who has he signed besides Nas? Rick Ro$$? Sam Scarfo?? No one that's really winning like they should be.
yea, and he really f*cked the Roots. after the initial hype of the Roots signing to Def Jam, there was basically zero promotion of their album. what makes things worse is that this was supposed to be THE album from the Roots. now its as if they had their shot and blew it. i doubt u will see them backing jay up at any future concerts.
So wait - let me just get this right...according to people at Def Jam, the only reason why Jay-Z recorded "Kingdom Come" was b/c Budweiser gave him money to do it?
Only reason? No... main motivating factor? Yes.
From what I understand, Jay's need to rescue his label from tanking after a series of flops would be a far more compelling reason than b/c Bud threw some money at him. In any case, the Budweiser angle isn't what I'd call a "fact" since the latter would assume that it's information everyone is aware of. I'm pretty sure no one - including at Def Jam - is making it public knowledge, "yeah, Jay cut this album b/c Budweiser gave him x-amount of dollars to do it."
Jay is obsessed with his legacy--Budweiser couldn't possibly offer him enough money to put out an album that he didn't want to put out.
If he were that obsessed with his legacy then he would have put out a dope album, not this mediocre terd.
Right, putting out a mediocre album was obviously a calculated decision on his part.
So wait - let me just get this right...according to people at Def Jam, the only reason why Jay-Z recorded "Kingdom Come" was b/c Budweiser gave him money to do it?
Only reason? No... main motivating factor? Yes.
From what I understand, Jay's need to rescue his label from tanking after a series of flops would be a far more compelling reason than b/c Bud threw some money at him. In any case, the Budweiser angle isn't what I'd call a "fact" since the latter would assume that it's information everyone is aware of. I'm pretty sure no one - including at Def Jam - is making it public knowledge, "yeah, Jay cut this album b/c Budweiser gave him x-amount of dollars to do it."
Jay is obsessed with his legacy--Budweiser couldn't possibly offer him enough money to put out an album that he didn't want to put out.
If he were that obsessed with his legacy then he would have put out a dope album, not this mediocre terd.
Right, putting out a mediocre album was obviously a calculated decision on his part.
its his album right? and he IS the president of DEF JAM right? Its all on him, who else had any hand or creative control in it? What A&R is going to tell his boss that the track or rhyme is weak? Its weak on first through 20th listen, if the average listener can figure that out, how is Jay unable to hear it? If like you said, his legacy is in question and is the real reason he put this record out, how could he even possibly put out anythig bordering on marginal? Especially after the Black Album? Sorry that doesn't make sense which makes me think that this album has nada to do with Jay's legacy outside of being a part of it.
Its weak on first through 20th listen, if the average listener can figure that out, how is Jay unable to hear it?
Do you even listen to rap?
Or any kind of popular music?
I'm just wondering.
A lot of artists struggle to distinguish between their own good and bad material. Jay attempted to do something very difficult with this album--in some cases he succeeded, and in others he failed.
You not liking the album is hardly evidence that Jay himself didn't like it as he was assembling it.
But then you've already admitted to not being a fan in this very thread.
Its weak on first through 20th listen, if the average listener can figure that out, how is Jay unable to hear it?
Do you even listen to rap?
Or any kind of popular music?
I'm just wondering.
A lot of artists struggle to distinguish between their own good and bad material. Jay attempted to do something very difficult with this album--in some cases he succeeded, and in others he failed.
You not liking the album is hardly evidence that Jay himself didn't like it as he was assembling it.
But then you've already admitted to not being a fan in this very thread.
I know you are the armchair champion of everything Jay-Z but don't get all sweaty when someone critiques this album for what it is. I am sure he knew exactly what he was doing and that was making a dollar. I hardly see this as an album by Jay-Z for Jay-Z and his fans. If so its a very weak attempt, and as much as you would like to justify this album, he has made multiple good and great albums and at the very least has one or two standout tracks on his weaker albums. This is a mediocre album with no real standout tracks. You don't think for one instant that if it were his Legacy as a rapper at stake with this album that he would have made damn sure that this was a heater from start to finish? I mean we are talking about an artist that has over 6 albums under his belt. My only argument is that this has nothing to do with legacy, its money only, and a smart move on his part as I am sure from this point on he is CEO only.
And yeh i am not a fan, but it doesn't matter to me. A good album is a good album and a bad album is a bad album whether its an artist I like or dislike.
Its weak on first through 20th listen, if the average listener can figure that out, how is Jay unable to hear it?
Do you even listen to rap?
Or any kind of popular music?
I'm just wondering.
A lot of artists struggle to distinguish between their own good and bad material. Jay attempted to do something very difficult with this album--in some cases he succeeded, and in others he failed.
You not liking the album is hardly evidence that Jay himself didn't like it as he was assembling it.
But then you've already admitted to not being a fan in this very thread.
I know you are the armchair champion of everything Jay-Z but don't get all sweaty when someone critiques this album for what it is. I am sure he knew exactly what he was doing and that was making a dollar. I hardly see this as an album by Jay-Z for Jay-Z and his fans. If so its a very weak attempt, and as much as you would like to justify this album, he has made multiple good and great albums and at the very least has one or two standout tracks on his weaker albums. This is a mediocre album with no real standout tracks. You don't think for one instant that if it were his Legacy as a rapper at stake with this album that he would have made damn sure that this was a heater from start to finish? I mean we are talking about an artist that has over 6 albums under his belt. My only argument is that this has nothing to do with legacy, its money only, and a smart move on his part as I am sure from this point on he is CEO only.
Are you really this dense?
You keep going on about how it's not a good album; you're certainly entitled to that opinion, but repeating it gets you no closer to establishing that Jay-z shares it.
And yeh i am not a fan, but it doesn't matter to me. A good album is a good album and a bad album is a bad album whether its an artist I like or dislike.
If Jay-z's previous eight (no, not six) albums weren't sufficient to make you a fan, you're clearly incapable of recognizing a good album.
faux - you're being uncharacteristically defensive about this terd of an album.
are you feeling some empathy as another aging money man who should've left tha game years ago?
Noz--you're displaying an uncharacteristic lack of reading comprehension. I am arguing only that there's no reason to believe Jay-z intended to put out a weak album, not that he succeeded in putting out a good one.
Although, if we're going to be sharing, I will say that I think it's better than a lot of people on here want to admit.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
faux - you're being uncharacteristically defensive about this terd of an album.
are you feeling some empathy as another aging money man who should've left tha game years ago?
Noz--you're displaying an uncharacteristic lack of reading comprehension. I am arguing only that there's no reason to believe Jay-z intended to put out a weak album, not that he succeeded in putting out a good one.
Although, if we're going to be sharing, I will say that I think it's better than a lot of people on here want to admit.
You sleep with a copy under your pillow, don't you?
Noz--you're displaying an uncharacteristic lack of reading comprehension. I am arguing only that there's no reason to believe Jay-z intended to put out a weak album, not that he succeeded in putting out a good one.
i wasn't referring specifically to this thread, but to several can he live? type comments you've made since the record's release. Such as...
Although, if we're going to be sharing, I will say that I think it's better than a lot of people on here want to admit.
Its weak on first through 20th listen, if the average listener can figure that out, how is Jay unable to hear it?
Do you even listen to rap?
Or any kind of popular music?
I'm just wondering.
A lot of artists struggle to distinguish between their own good and bad material. Jay attempted to do something very difficult with this album--in some cases he succeeded, and in others he failed.
You not liking the album is hardly evidence that Jay himself didn't like it as he was assembling it.
But then you've already admitted to not being a fan in this very thread.
I know you are the armchair champion of everything Jay-Z but don't get all sweaty when someone critiques this album for what it is. I am sure he knew exactly what he was doing and that was making a dollar. I hardly see this as an album by Jay-Z for Jay-Z and his fans. If so its a very weak attempt, and as much as you would like to justify this album, he has made multiple good and great albums and at the very least has one or two standout tracks on his weaker albums. This is a mediocre album with no real standout tracks. You don't think for one instant that if it were his Legacy as a rapper at stake with this album that he would have made damn sure that this was a heater from start to finish? I mean we are talking about an artist that has over 6 albums under his belt. My only argument is that this has nothing to do with legacy, its money only, and a smart move on his part as I am sure from this point on he is CEO only.
Are you really this dense?
You keep going on about how it's not a good album; you're certainly entitled to that opinion, but repeating it gets you no closer to establishing that Jay-z shares it.
And yeh i am not a fan, but it doesn't matter to me. A good album is a good album and a bad album is a bad album whether its an artist I like or dislike.
If Jay-z's previous eight (no, not six) albums weren't sufficient to make you a fan, you're clearly incapable of recognizing a good album.
RIF - "over 6 Albums". Are you this dense that you are ignoring the point? We were at one point talking about this album having anything to do with his legacy as a rapper. Yes his name is on it, but now his name is bigger than an album or bigger than being a rapper, its now a brandname. Yes the mediocrity of the album does reflect on his brandname now, but he is also, as stated in the article above, focusing on multiple ventures. This album is a drop in the bucket and if anything it secured his legacy as a businessman by working with Budweiser. he has taken Puffy style business approaches in music to the next level. He is in the midst of his transition from rapper to corporate/brandname powerhouse. So no I do not think that this album is anything more than a kickstart to everything else he has planned. If it failed it would have been drastic, but the fact that its going to be the top selling hip-hop album for 2006 in the first week is securing him as a brandname powerhouse, not necessarily his legacy as a music artist. His legacy was already set when he dropped the black album.
And I wasn't a fan since the Jaz-O days. Him dropping a million albums would not make me a fan because I never liked his style and the fact he (so obviously) bites other rappers and their styles. That doesn't mean he can't or hasn't make good albums. Open your eyes, I think you have been staring at legal briefs too long.
faux - you're being uncharacteristically defensive about this terd of an album.
are you feeling some empathy as another aging money man who should've left tha game years ago?
Noz--you're displaying an uncharacteristic lack of reading comprehension. I am arguing only that there's no reason to believe Jay-z intended to put out a weak album, not that he succeeded in putting out a good one.
Although, if we're going to be sharing, I will say that I think it's better than a lot of people on here want to admit.
You sleep with a copy under your pillow, don't you?
If, in your world, a lukewarm assessment such as "better than SoulStrut dudes want to admit" betrays a habit of sleeping with a copy of the thing in question under one's pillow, I can only begin to imagine what sorts of things have found their way beneath your own low-threadcount pillowcase. Is that where Project Blowed's careers disappeared to?
Its weak on first through 20th listen, if the average listener can figure that out, how is Jay unable to hear it?
Do you even listen to rap?
Or any kind of popular music?
I'm just wondering.
A lot of artists struggle to distinguish between their own good and bad material. Jay attempted to do something very difficult with this album--in some cases he succeeded, and in others he failed.
You not liking the album is hardly evidence that Jay himself didn't like it as he was assembling it.
But then you've already admitted to not being a fan in this very thread.
I know you are the armchair champion of everything Jay-Z but don't get all sweaty when someone critiques this album for what it is. I am sure he knew exactly what he was doing and that was making a dollar. I hardly see this as an album by Jay-Z for Jay-Z and his fans. If so its a very weak attempt, and as much as you would like to justify this album, he has made multiple good and great albums and at the very least has one or two standout tracks on his weaker albums. This is a mediocre album with no real standout tracks. You don't think for one instant that if it were his Legacy as a rapper at stake with this album that he would have made damn sure that this was a heater from start to finish? I mean we are talking about an artist that has over 6 albums under his belt. My only argument is that this has nothing to do with legacy, its money only, and a smart move on his part as I am sure from this point on he is CEO only.
Are you really this dense?
You keep going on about how it's not a good album; you're certainly entitled to that opinion, but repeating it gets you no closer to establishing that Jay-z shares it.
And yeh i am not a fan, but it doesn't matter to me. A good album is a good album and a bad album is a bad album whether its an artist I like or dislike.
If Jay-z's previous eight (no, not six) albums weren't sufficient to make you a fan, you're clearly incapable of recognizing a good album.
RIF - "over 6 Albums". Are you this dense that you are ignoring the point? We were at one point talking about this album having anything to do with his legacy as a rapper. Yes his name is on it, but now his name is bigger than an album or bigger than being a rapper, its now a brandname. Yes the mediocrity of the album does reflect on his brandname now, but he is also, as stated in the article above, focusing on multiple ventures. This album is a drop in the bucket and if anything it secured his legacy as a businessman by working with Budweiser. he has taken Puffy style business approaches in music to the next level. He is in the midst of his transition from rapper to corporate/brandname powerhouse. So no I do not think that this album is anything more than a kickstart to everything else he has planned. If it failed it would have been drastic, but the fact that its going to be the top selling hip-hop album for 2006 in the first week is securing him as a brandname powerhouse, not necessarily his legacy as a music artist. His legacy was already set when he dropped the black album.
He became a brand long ago--something that he accomplished in large part through being the best and most respected rapper of his era. I have yet to hear an explanation for why intentionally putting out a bad album is the next level in the branding process.
beyond the occasional soul and funk album talk, another reason I love this site is I get to read about grown men getting their feelings hurt when someone talks about there favorite rapper.
faux - you're being uncharacteristically defensive about this terd of an album.
are you feeling some empathy as another aging money man who should've left tha game years ago?
Noz--you're displaying an uncharacteristic lack of reading comprehension. I am arguing only that there's no reason to believe Jay-z intended to put out a weak album, not that he succeeded in putting out a good one.
Although, if we're going to be sharing, I will say that I think it's better than a lot of people on here want to admit.
You sleep with a copy under your pillow, don't you?
If, in your world, a lukewarm assessment such as "better than SoulStrut dudes want to admit" betrays a habit of sleeping with a copy of the thing in question under one's pillow, I can only begin to imagine what sorts of things have found their way beneath your own low-threadcount pillowcase. Is that where Project Blowed's careers disappeared to?
I'm concerned that this post may cause some to question if you are mad, doggie.
Its weak on first through 20th listen, if the average listener can figure that out, how is Jay unable to hear it?
Do you even listen to rap?
Or any kind of popular music?
I'm just wondering.
A lot of artists struggle to distinguish between their own good and bad material. Jay attempted to do something very difficult with this album--in some cases he succeeded, and in others he failed.
You not liking the album is hardly evidence that Jay himself didn't like it as he was assembling it.
But then you've already admitted to not being a fan in this very thread.
I know you are the armchair champion of everything Jay-Z but don't get all sweaty when someone critiques this album for what it is. I am sure he knew exactly what he was doing and that was making a dollar. I hardly see this as an album by Jay-Z for Jay-Z and his fans. If so its a very weak attempt, and as much as you would like to justify this album, he has made multiple good and great albums and at the very least has one or two standout tracks on his weaker albums. This is a mediocre album with no real standout tracks. You don't think for one instant that if it were his Legacy as a rapper at stake with this album that he would have made damn sure that this was a heater from start to finish? I mean we are talking about an artist that has over 6 albums under his belt. My only argument is that this has nothing to do with legacy, its money only, and a smart move on his part as I am sure from this point on he is CEO only.
Are you really this dense?
You keep going on about how it's not a good album; you're certainly entitled to that opinion, but repeating it gets you no closer to establishing that Jay-z shares it.
And yeh i am not a fan, but it doesn't matter to me. A good album is a good album and a bad album is a bad album whether its an artist I like or dislike.
If Jay-z's previous eight (no, not six) albums weren't sufficient to make you a fan, you're clearly incapable of recognizing a good album.
RIF - "over 6 Albums". Are you this dense that you are ignoring the point? We were at one point talking about this album having anything to do with his legacy as a rapper. Yes his name is on it, but now his name is bigger than an album or bigger than being a rapper, its now a brandname. Yes the mediocrity of the album does reflect on his brandname now, but he is also, as stated in the article above, focusing on multiple ventures. This album is a drop in the bucket and if anything it secured his legacy as a businessman by working with Budweiser. he has taken Puffy style business approaches in music to the next level. He is in the midst of his transition from rapper to corporate/brandname powerhouse. So no I do not think that this album is anything more than a kickstart to everything else he has planned. If it failed it would have been drastic, but the fact that its going to be the top selling hip-hop album for 2006 in the first week is securing him as a brandname powerhouse, not necessarily his legacy as a music artist. His legacy was already set when he dropped the black album.
He became a brand long ago--something that he accomplished in large part through being the best and most respected rapper of his era. I have yet to hear an explanation for why intentionally putting out a bad album is the next level in the branding process.
Shied chatter
hahaha maybe in your private mind garden, however to the rest of the corporate world who he has been trying to, and has now successfully courted, he was another rapper. That is IF they even knew who he was.
RIF - I never said it was a bad album, its just not a good or great album. Its average and thats all he needs at this point to transition his career.
Its weak on first through 20th listen, if the average listener can figure that out, how is Jay unable to hear it?
Do you even listen to rap?
Or any kind of popular music?
I'm just wondering.
A lot of artists struggle to distinguish between their own good and bad material. Jay attempted to do something very difficult with this album--in some cases he succeeded, and in others he failed.
You not liking the album is hardly evidence that Jay himself didn't like it as he was assembling it.
But then you've already admitted to not being a fan in this very thread.
I know you are the armchair champion of everything Jay-Z but don't get all sweaty when someone critiques this album for what it is. I am sure he knew exactly what he was doing and that was making a dollar. I hardly see this as an album by Jay-Z for Jay-Z and his fans. If so its a very weak attempt, and as much as you would like to justify this album, he has made multiple good and great albums and at the very least has one or two standout tracks on his weaker albums. This is a mediocre album with no real standout tracks. You don't think for one instant that if it were his Legacy as a rapper at stake with this album that he would have made damn sure that this was a heater from start to finish? I mean we are talking about an artist that has over 6 albums under his belt. My only argument is that this has nothing to do with legacy, its money only, and a smart move on his part as I am sure from this point on he is CEO only.
Are you really this dense?
You keep going on about how it's not a good album; you're certainly entitled to that opinion, but repeating it gets you no closer to establishing that Jay-z shares it.
And yeh i am not a fan, but it doesn't matter to me. A good album is a good album and a bad album is a bad album whether its an artist I like or dislike.
If Jay-z's previous eight (no, not six) albums weren't sufficient to make you a fan, you're clearly incapable of recognizing a good album.
RIF - "over 6 Albums". Are you this dense that you are ignoring the point? We were at one point talking about this album having anything to do with his legacy as a rapper. Yes his name is on it, but now his name is bigger than an album or bigger than being a rapper, its now a brandname. Yes the mediocrity of the album does reflect on his brandname now, but he is also, as stated in the article above, focusing on multiple ventures. This album is a drop in the bucket and if anything it secured his legacy as a businessman by working with Budweiser. he has taken Puffy style business approaches in music to the next level. He is in the midst of his transition from rapper to corporate/brandname powerhouse. So no I do not think that this album is anything more than a kickstart to everything else he has planned. If it failed it would have been drastic, but the fact that its going to be the top selling hip-hop album for 2006 in the first week is securing him as a brandname powerhouse, not necessarily his legacy as a music artist. His legacy was already set when he dropped the black album.
He became a brand long ago--something that he accomplished in large part through being the best and most respected rapper of his era. I have yet to hear an explanation for why intentionally putting out a bad album is the next level in the branding process.
Shied chatter
hahaha maybe in your private mind garden, however to the rest of the corporate world who he has been trying to, and has now successfully courted, he was another rapper. That is IF they even knew who he was.
RIF - I never said it was a bad album, its just not a good or great album. Its average and thats all he needs at this point to transition his career.
You must have intended the positive connotation of "mediocre terd"--pardon my confusion.
I'm not invested in this album--having only listened to it a handful of times--but I'm also not yet ready to join the chorus of dudes labelling it the definitive falloff, many of whom I suspected reacted in the same way to Hard Knock Life, another point in his career where he shifted direction and which has emerged over the years as one of his best albums.
You can choose to believe that Jay is only now attempting some daring crossover to the mainstream, but that's just not the case--he was shilling for Heinekin years before he endorsed Budweiser. Yes, he has achieved ever greater recognition amongst people that don't listen to rap over the years, but the crossover began long ago. Dude had already sold 8 or 10 million albums by the turn of the millenium, the vast majority of which were not purchased by die-hard hip-hop heads.
None of this is really here or there, though, when it somes to supporting your contention that he would intentionally put out a bad "mediocre terdlike" album. I still want to hear the theory of how that = good business.
Its weak on first through 20th listen, if the average listener can figure that out, how is Jay unable to hear it?
Do you even listen to rap?
Or any kind of popular music?
I'm just wondering.
A lot of artists struggle to distinguish between their own good and bad material. Jay attempted to do something very difficult with this album--in some cases he succeeded, and in others he failed.
You not liking the album is hardly evidence that Jay himself didn't like it as he was assembling it.
But then you've already admitted to not being a fan in this very thread.
I know you are the armchair champion of everything Jay-Z but don't get all sweaty when someone critiques this album for what it is. I am sure he knew exactly what he was doing and that was making a dollar. I hardly see this as an album by Jay-Z for Jay-Z and his fans. If so its a very weak attempt, and as much as you would like to justify this album, he has made multiple good and great albums and at the very least has one or two standout tracks on his weaker albums. This is a mediocre album with no real standout tracks. You don't think for one instant that if it were his Legacy as a rapper at stake with this album that he would have made damn sure that this was a heater from start to finish? I mean we are talking about an artist that has over 6 albums under his belt. My only argument is that this has nothing to do with legacy, its money only, and a smart move on his part as I am sure from this point on he is CEO only.
Are you really this dense?
You keep going on about how it's not a good album; you're certainly entitled to that opinion, but repeating it gets you no closer to establishing that Jay-z shares it.
And yeh i am not a fan, but it doesn't matter to me. A good album is a good album and a bad album is a bad album whether its an artist I like or dislike.
If Jay-z's previous eight (no, not six) albums weren't sufficient to make you a fan, you're clearly incapable of recognizing a good album.
RIF - "over 6 Albums". Are you this dense that you are ignoring the point? We were at one point talking about this album having anything to do with his legacy as a rapper. Yes his name is on it, but now his name is bigger than an album or bigger than being a rapper, its now a brandname. Yes the mediocrity of the album does reflect on his brandname now, but he is also, as stated in the article above, focusing on multiple ventures. This album is a drop in the bucket and if anything it secured his legacy as a businessman by working with Budweiser. he has taken Puffy style business approaches in music to the next level. He is in the midst of his transition from rapper to corporate/brandname powerhouse. So no I do not think that this album is anything more than a kickstart to everything else he has planned. If it failed it would have been drastic, but the fact that its going to be the top selling hip-hop album for 2006 in the first week is securing him as a brandname powerhouse, not necessarily his legacy as a music artist. His legacy was already set when he dropped the black album.
He became a brand long ago--something that he accomplished in large part through being the best and most respected rapper of his era. I have yet to hear an explanation for why intentionally putting out a bad album is the next level in the branding process.
Shied chatter
hahaha maybe in your private mind garden, however to the rest of the corporate world who he has been trying to, and has now successfully courted, he was another rapper. That is IF they even knew who he was.
RIF - I never said it was a bad album, its just not a good or great album. Its average and thats all he needs at this point to transition his career.
You must have intended the positive connotation of "mediocre terd"--pardon my confusion.
I'm not invested in this album--having only listened to it a handful of times--but I'm also not yet ready to join the chorus of dudes labelling it the definitive falloff, many of whom I suspected reacted in the same way to Hard Knock Life, another point in his career where he shifted direction and which has emerged over the years as one of his best albums.
You can choose to believe that Jay is only now attempting some daring crossover to the mainstream, but that's just not the case--he was shilling for Heinekin years before he endorsed Budweiser. Yes, he has achieved ever greater recognition amongst people that don't listen to rap over the years, but the crossover began long ago. Dude had already sold 8 or 10 million albums by the turn of the millenium, the vast majority of which were not purchased by die-hard hip-hop heads.
None of this is really here or there, though, when it somes to supporting your contention that he would intentionally put out a bad "mediocre terdlike" album. I still want to hear the theory of how that = good business.
Hov needs to hire you for some p.r. and shit. Mabye you're right and were all being reactionary because it sounds different than what we are used to. Honestly, id rather believe that than accept that jay finally dropped a shit sandwhich.
However, i dont hear anything particularly innovative coming out of this album. What was it that was so different that he was trying to do?
I think some of you folls would be pretty surprised to find out that there are a lot of people outside the Strut who think this album is actually pretty good.
Carry on.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
faux - you're being uncharacteristically defensive about this terd of an album.
are you feeling some empathy as another aging money man who should've left tha game years ago?
Noz--you're displaying an uncharacteristic lack of reading comprehension. I am arguing only that there's no reason to believe Jay-z intended to put out a weak album, not that he succeeded in putting out a good one.
Although, if we're going to be sharing, I will say that I think it's better than a lot of people on here want to admit.
You sleep with a copy under your pillow, don't you?
If, in your world, a lukewarm assessment such as "better than SoulStrut dudes want to admit" betrays a habit of sleeping with a copy of the thing in question under one's pillow, I can only begin to imagine what sorts of things have found their way beneath your own low-threadcount pillowcase. Is that where Project Blowed's careers disappeared to?
Like I have any friggin clue what threadcount my pillowcase is...
Comments
If he were that obsessed with his legacy then he would have put out a dope album, not this mediocre terd.
yea, and he really f*cked the Roots. after the initial hype of the Roots signing to Def Jam, there was basically zero promotion of their album. what makes things worse is that this was supposed to be THE album from the Roots. now its as if they had their shot and blew it. i doubt u will see them backing jay up at any future concerts.
Right, putting out a mediocre album was obviously a calculated decision on his part.
its his album right? and he IS the president of DEF JAM right? Its all on him, who else had any hand or creative control in it? What A&R is going to tell his boss that the track or rhyme is weak? Its weak on first through 20th listen, if the average listener can figure that out, how is Jay unable to hear it? If like you said, his legacy is in question and is the real reason he put this record out, how could he even possibly put out anythig bordering on marginal? Especially after the Black Album? Sorry that doesn't make sense which makes me think that this album has nada to do with Jay's legacy outside of being a part of it.
Do you even listen to rap?
Or any kind of popular music?
I'm just wondering.
A lot of artists struggle to distinguish between their own good and bad material. Jay attempted to do something very difficult with this album--in some cases he succeeded, and in others he failed.
You not liking the album is hardly evidence that Jay himself didn't like it as he was assembling it.
But then you've already admitted to not being a fan in this very thread.
are you feeling some empathy as another aging money man who should've left tha game years ago?
I know you are the armchair champion of everything Jay-Z but don't get all sweaty when someone critiques this album for what it is. I am sure he knew exactly what he was doing and that was making a dollar. I hardly see this as an album by Jay-Z for Jay-Z and his fans. If so its a very weak attempt, and as much as you would like to justify this album, he has made multiple good and great albums and at the very least has one or two standout tracks on his weaker albums. This is a mediocre album with no real standout tracks. You don't think for one instant that if it were his Legacy as a rapper at stake with this album that he would have made damn sure that this was a heater from start to finish? I mean we are talking about an artist that has over 6 albums under his belt. My only argument is that this has nothing to do with legacy, its money only, and a smart move on his part as I am sure from this point on he is CEO only.
And yeh i am not a fan, but it doesn't matter to me. A good album is a good album and a bad album is a bad album whether its an artist I like or dislike.
Are you really this dense?
You keep going on about how it's not a good album; you're certainly entitled to that opinion, but repeating it gets you no closer to establishing that Jay-z shares it.
If Jay-z's previous eight (no, not six) albums weren't sufficient to make you a fan, you're clearly incapable of recognizing a good album.
Noz--you're displaying an uncharacteristic lack of reading comprehension. I am arguing only that there's no reason to believe Jay-z intended to put out a weak album, not that he succeeded in putting out a good one.
Although, if we're going to be sharing, I will say that I think it's better than a lot of people on here want to admit.
You sleep with a copy under your pillow, don't you?
i wasn't referring specifically to this thread, but to several can he live? type comments you've made since the record's release. Such as...
RIF - "over 6 Albums". Are you this dense that you are ignoring the point? We were at one point talking about this album having anything to do with his legacy as a rapper. Yes his name is on it, but now his name is bigger than an album or bigger than being a rapper, its now a brandname. Yes the mediocrity of the album does reflect on his brandname now, but he is also, as stated in the article above, focusing on multiple ventures. This album is a drop in the bucket and if anything it secured his legacy as a businessman by working with Budweiser. he has taken Puffy style business approaches in music to the next level. He is in the midst of his transition from rapper to corporate/brandname powerhouse. So no I do not think that this album is anything more than a kickstart to everything else he has planned. If it failed it would have been drastic, but the fact that its going to be the top selling hip-hop album for 2006 in the first week is securing him as a brandname powerhouse, not necessarily his legacy as a music artist. His legacy was already set when he dropped the black album.
And I wasn't a fan since the Jaz-O days. Him dropping a million albums would not make me a fan because I never liked his style and the fact he (so obviously) bites other rappers and their styles. That doesn't mean he can't or hasn't make good albums. Open your eyes, I think you have been staring at legal briefs too long.
If, in your world, a lukewarm assessment such as "better than SoulStrut dudes want to admit" betrays a habit of sleeping with a copy of the thing in question under one's pillow, I can only begin to imagine what sorts of things have found their way beneath your own low-threadcount pillowcase. Is that where Project Blowed's careers disappeared to?
He became a brand long ago--something that he accomplished in large part through being the best and most respected rapper of his era. I have yet to hear an explanation for why intentionally putting out a bad album is the next level in the branding process.
I'm concerned that this post may cause some to question if you are mad, doggie.
hahaha maybe in your private mind garden, however to the rest of the corporate world who he has been trying to, and has now successfully courted, he was another rapper. That is IF they even knew who he was.
RIF - I never said it was a bad album, its just not a good or great album. Its average and thats all he needs at this point to transition his career.
"I wanna be saaaaaaaaaved"
Fixed your post for you, Suga Deej.
I guess its not 100% terrible, but its a pretty bad album any way you slice it.
At least if there was even 1 timbaland track on it that was amazing i could cosign the effort. But seeing as how that didnt even happen, i dunno.
You must have intended the positive connotation of "mediocre terd"--pardon my confusion.
I'm not invested in this album--having only listened to it a handful of times--but I'm also not yet ready to join the chorus of dudes labelling it the definitive falloff, many of whom I suspected reacted in the same way to Hard Knock Life, another point in his career where he shifted direction and which has emerged over the years as one of his best albums.
You can choose to believe that Jay is only now attempting some daring crossover to the mainstream, but that's just not the case--he was shilling for Heinekin years before he endorsed Budweiser. Yes, he has achieved ever greater recognition amongst people that don't listen to rap over the years, but the crossover began long ago. Dude had already sold 8 or 10 million albums by the turn of the millenium, the vast majority of which were not purchased by die-hard hip-hop heads.
None of this is really here or there, though, when it somes to supporting your contention that he would intentionally put out a
bad"mediocre terdlike" album. I still want to hear the theory of how that = good business.Hov needs to hire you for some p.r. and shit. Mabye you're right and were all being reactionary because it sounds different than what we are used to. Honestly, id rather believe that than accept that jay finally dropped a shit sandwhich.
However, i dont hear anything particularly innovative coming out of this album. What was it that was so different that he was trying to do?
Carry on.
Like I have any friggin clue what threadcount my pillowcase is...