I'm not familiar with The Guardian, but I guess the "Without This..." part is supposed to be funny, no ?
so ridiculous, it has to be
...while I enjoy much of the writing the paper is prone to being so smugly ironic and superior sometimes that you want to burn it!!!!! Therefore, take it all with a pinch of salt and know that 90% the entries will be there purely to wind people up and for people to smile...bla...bla...
The "Without This..." part... FFUUCCKK TTHHAATT !!
DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
am I the only one that finds Raw Power to be pretty compared to the first two Stooges albums?
You are not.
This is interesting. Much as I love the first two albums (esp. "Fun House"), "Raw Power" is still probably my favourite Stooges record. I remember hearing it a couple of times as a kid, but I never actually owned it until 1977, when it was reissued in the UK in the wake of the whole punk thing. Although I liked it at the time, I used to hate the way it was recorded. The rhythm section sounded as if they were playing at the end of an alley across the street from the studio, and it seemed as if the whole record had been mixed by someone wearing handcuffs. When it was reissued on CD in 1997 though, it was marketed as an authorised (by Iggy) remix. A few years ago, someone told me that what it was in reality, was a re-EQ'ed version taken from the ????? two-track master - apparently, the original multi-track had been irreparably damaged, and the two-track was all they had left to work with, so we'll never hear a true remixed/remastered version. Nevertheless, the 1997 CD version is fucking blazing - the whole thing leaps out and smacks you in the grill in a way the original never did. Most people I know prefer the lo-fi feel of the o.g., but for me, the '97 version is much closer to how I always wanted to hear it.
Whoever hired that person to make that list is incredibly wack.
Mary J. Blige WAY above Thriller?
You even go The Strokes in there! LOL
"What's The 411" is there because of its level of influence as an album, which was enormous. Before that record came out, r&b was pretty much yer Anita Baker, Luther Vandross and Jam & Lewis on one side, and New Jack Swing on the other. I have a lot of time for all that stuff, but in terms of anything fresh there wasn't a whole lot happening in r&b in 1992. Now, everyone knows that all Puffy did with that record, and the subsequent remixes, was to put on wax what Kid Capri and Ron G had been doing on the mixtapes, but nevertheless he still took that concept and put it out there for an audience that wasn't really checking those tapes. For the people who were, just hearing that intro skit with the answerphone messages over the PSK beat let us know that this was something new. For me, that album completely changed r&b and is one of the landmark records of the last twenty years.
Definitely--an album whose influence is consistently underrecognized.
The very fact that they mention Dizzee Rascal twice in their "without...there'd be no..." sections invalidates the list in its entirety.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
"Thriller" is "Off The Wall" pt.2. Dunno what all the fuss was about here either. Oh yeah, the whiteys bought it because Van Halen was on it. Hence it being acceptable for whiteys in genral to own a "Black" record. It took until 1983 or whenever for this state of social affairs to happen?
Misinformed much?
DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
The very fact that they mention Dizzee Rascal twice in their "without...there'd be no..." sections invalidates the list in its entirety.
Again, it must be emphasised that this is written from a UK broadsheet perspective. Their handle on rap is generally woeful, and there's a tendency for a lot of writers outside of the specialist press to stay within a very narrow frame of reference. This can be because they're not neccesarily writing for a readership that's particularly music-savvy, so they like to keep the reference points familiar. It's because of this that the names of Diz and Roots will crop up perhaps a little more than maybe they ought, but sometimes it's borne of a plain old lack of familiarity on the writer's part. For example, when he's asked about his influences, I know for a fact that Diz frequently namechecks UGK and 3-6 in interviews, because on at least two occasions I've had friends who've interviewed him call me to ask who they are. Now, unless you're a rap fan, they're not gonna be names you immediately recognise, but I still get tired of seeing the same names every time a so-called quality paper writes about rap, because you know they're only writing about what they get in the mail.
Any southern rapper who's looking for an alternative weekly review should probably sign to TVT.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
The very fact that they mention Dizzee Rascal twice in their "without...there'd be no..." sections invalidates the list in its entirety.
Again, it must be emphasised that this is written from a UK broadsheet perspective. Their handle on rap is generally woeful, and there's a tendency for a lot of writers outside of the specialist press to stay within a very narrow frame of reference. This can be because they're not neccesarily writing for a readership that's particularly music-savvy, so they like to keep the reference points familiar. It's because of this that the names of Diz and Roots will crop up perhaps a little more than maybe they ought, but sometimes it's borne of a plain old lack of familiarity on the writer's part. For example, when he's asked about his influences, I know for a fact that Diz frequently namechecks UGK and 3-6 in interviews, because on at least two occasions I've had friends who've interviewed him call me to ask who they are. Now, unless you're a rap fan, they're not gonna be names you immediately recognise, but I still get tired of seeing the same names every time a so-called quality paper writes about rap, because you know they're only writing about what they get in the mail.
Dizzee "namechecked" UGK when I interviewed him a couple of years back as a pre-cursor to a show he was about to do here in Texas with Bun B on the bill. Whatever that's worth to you...
Specifically he said that UGK's "Choppin' Blades" was really important to him, which led us to talking about E-40.
JLee was at the show. Ask him how Dizzee was received by the Screwston-oriented crowd. For whatever that's worth to you as well...
am I the only one that finds Raw Power to be pretty compared to the first two Stooges albums?
You are not.
This is interesting. Much as I love the first two albums (esp. "Fun House"), "Raw Power" is still probably my favourite Stooges record. I remember hearing it a couple of times as a kid, but I never actually owned it until 1977, when it was reissued in the UK in the wake of the whole punk thing. Although I liked it at the time, I used to hate the way it was recorded. The rhythm section sounded as if they were playing at the end of an alley across the street from the studio, and it seemed as if the whole record had been mixed by someone wearing handcuffs. When it was reissued on CD in 1997 though, it was marketed as an authorised (by Iggy) remix. A few years ago, someone told me that what it was in reality, was a re-EQ'ed version taken from the ????? two-track master - apparently, the original multi-track had been irreparably damaged, and the two-track was all they had left to work with, so we'll never hear a true remixed/remastered version. Nevertheless, the 1997 CD version is fucking blazing - the whole thing leaps out and smacks you in the grill in a way the original never did. Most people I know prefer the lo-fi feel of the o.g., but for me, the '97 version is much closer to how I always wanted to hear it.
Yeah, the "Bowie free" version is like a completely different record.
What I meant was "Thriller" is like "Off The Wall" artistically - maybe actually failing to reach that bar - but got to break Jacko as a megastar thanks to Van Halen.
In perhaps the same way [massive generalisation] "Rap" was considered "Underground" until "Walk This Way".
Say it ain't so.
HarveyCanal"a distraction from my main thesis." 13,234 Posts
What I meant was "Thriller" is like "Off The Wall" artistically - maybe actually failing to reach that bar - but got to break Jacko as a megastar thanks to Van Halen.
In perhaps the same way [massive generalisation] "Rap" was considered "Underground" until "Walk This Way".
Say it ain't so.
It ain't so...if for no other reason than Billie Jean broke before Beat It.
I remember white people being conscious that Eddie Van Halen soloed on Beat It, but that was hardly the reason why Michael attained superstardom with Thriller. Chronoligically I think I recall The Girl is Mine being on the radio before Beat It as well...so if you really wanted to press the issue you might want to cite Paul McCartney instead of Eddie Van Halen. But that would be just as inaccurate for Thriller was simply undeniable to anyone regardless of race.
Edit: I went ahead and looked up dates for you:
1982 November The Girl Is Mine (With Paul McCartney)
What I meant was "Thriller" is like "Off The Wall" artistically - maybe actually failing to reach that bar - but got to break Jacko as a megastar thanks to Van Halen.
In perhaps the same way [massive generalisation] "Rap" was considered "Underground" until "Walk This Way".
Say it ain't so.
It ain't so...if for no other reason than Billie Jean broke before Beat It.
I remember white people being conscious that Eddie Van Halen soloed on Beat It, but that was hardly the reason why Michael attained superstardom with Thriller. Chronoligically I think I recall The Girl is Mine being on the radio before Beat It as well...so if you really wanted to press the issue you might want to cite Paul McCartney instead of Eddie Van Halen. But that would be just as inaccurate for Thriller was simply undeniable to anyone regardless of race.
Edit: I went ahead and looked up dates for you:
1982 November The Girl Is Mine (With Paul McCartney)
1983 January Billie Jean
1983 March Beat It
Fair enough.
I just remember hell hype around VH at the time. I agree with it being undeniable to anyone regardless of race too - but I would say the same about "Off The Wall" even moreso, which although it sold well, failed to cross over to the extent of, well, being parodied by Weird Al Jankovic.
I remember white people being conscious that Eddie Van Halen soloed on Beat It, but that was hardly the reason why Michael attained superstardom with Thriller.
I am saying--crediting the breakout success of Thriller to Eddie Van Halen is bizarre.
I didn't even know he played on it until this thread.
I am saying--crediting the breakout success of Thriller to Eddie Van Halen is bizarre.
I didn't even know he played on it until this thread.
Disconnected from the Hot Licks!
Seriously, though: the first time I heard "Beat It" on the radio, the DJ actually introduced it as "the new song by Michael Jackson and Eddie Van Halen." But I don't think that EVH had shit to do with that album being as huge as it is, beyond the fact that he laced that song with good guitar (no Eruption).
British music journalism is so full of bullshit and pretention not to mention that lists like are generally pointless because they always reflect the bandwagon that every doche bags is jumping on.
SCREW THE BRITISH & THEIR COMPULSIVE MUSIC LISTENIN'
I remember white people being conscious that Eddie Van Halen soloed on Beat It, but that was hardly the reason why Michael attained superstardom with Thriller.
I am saying--crediting the breakout success of Thriller to Eddie Van Halen is bizarre.
I didn't even know he played on it until this thread.
yeah me neither. speaking as a white dude who grew up around a lot of other white dudes in the 80s, everyone I know had that album, and it definitely wasn't because of Eddie Van Halen or Paul McCartney.
as sweet as that wire list is what the title implies is far less tounge in cheek than it should be. i mean, sure the dead c begat pavement and sebadoh, but the only people that really care are, well, people that read wire i guess.
plus i'd put day of niagara instead of four violins. and throw on 1/2 gentlemen not beasts.
Comments
The "Without This..." part... FFUUCCKK TTHHAATT !!
This is interesting. Much as I love the first two albums (esp. "Fun House"), "Raw Power" is still probably my favourite Stooges record. I remember hearing it a couple of times as a kid, but I never actually owned it until 1977, when it was reissued in the UK in the wake of the whole punk thing. Although I liked it at the time, I used to hate the way it was recorded. The rhythm section sounded as if they were playing at the end of an alley across the street from the studio, and it seemed as if the whole record had been mixed by someone wearing handcuffs. When it was reissued on CD in 1997 though, it was marketed as an authorised (by Iggy) remix. A few years ago, someone told me that what it was in reality, was a re-EQ'ed version taken from the ????? two-track master - apparently, the original multi-track had been irreparably damaged, and the two-track was all they had left to work with, so we'll never hear a true remixed/remastered version. Nevertheless, the 1997 CD version is fucking blazing - the whole thing leaps out and smacks you in the grill in a way the original never did. Most people I know prefer the lo-fi feel of the o.g., but for me, the '97 version is much closer to how I always wanted to hear it.
Definitely--an album whose influence is consistently underrecognized.
Misinformed much?
Again, it must be emphasised that this is written from a UK broadsheet perspective. Their handle on rap is generally woeful, and there's a tendency for a lot of writers outside of the specialist press to stay within a very narrow frame of reference. This can be because they're not neccesarily writing for a readership that's particularly music-savvy, so they like to keep the reference points familiar. It's because of this that the names of Diz and Roots will crop up perhaps a little more than maybe they ought, but sometimes it's borne of a plain old lack of familiarity on the writer's part. For example, when he's asked about his influences, I know for a fact that Diz frequently namechecks UGK and 3-6 in interviews, because on at least two occasions I've had friends who've interviewed him call me to ask who they are. Now, unless you're a rap fan, they're not gonna be names you immediately recognise, but I still get tired of seeing the same names every time a so-called quality paper writes about rap, because you know they're only writing about what they get in the mail.
Any southern rapper who's looking for an alternative weekly review should probably sign to TVT.
Dizzee "namechecked" UGK when I interviewed him a couple of years back as a pre-cursor to a show he was about to do here in Texas with Bun B on the bill. Whatever that's worth to you...
Specifically he said that UGK's "Choppin' Blades" was really important to him, which led us to talking about E-40.
JLee was at the show. Ask him how Dizzee was received by the Screwston-oriented crowd. For whatever that's worth to you as well...
Yeah, the "Bowie free" version is like a completely different record.
That and ACDC's Back in Black.
Corn biscuit critics always hated on Van Halen.
In perhaps the same way [massive generalisation] "Rap" was considered "Underground" until "Walk This Way".
Say it ain't so.
It ain't so...if for no other reason than Billie Jean broke before Beat It.
I remember white people being conscious that Eddie Van Halen soloed on Beat It, but that was hardly the reason why Michael attained superstardom with Thriller. Chronoligically I think I recall The Girl is Mine being on the radio before Beat It as well...so if you really wanted to press the issue you might want to cite Paul McCartney instead of Eddie Van Halen. But that would be just as inaccurate for Thriller was simply undeniable to anyone regardless of race.
Edit: I went ahead and looked up dates for you:
1982
November
The Girl Is Mine (With Paul McCartney)
1983
January
Billie Jean
1983
March
Beat It
Fair enough.
I just remember hell hype around VH at the time. I agree with it being undeniable to anyone regardless of race too - but I would say the same about "Off The Wall" even moreso, which although it sold well, failed to cross over to the extent of, well, being parodied by Weird Al Jankovic.
"White and Nerdy" and it is a parody of "Ridin Dirty"
I am saying--crediting the breakout success of Thriller to Eddie Van Halen is bizarre.
I didn't even know he played on it until this thread.
Disconnected from the Hot Licks!
Seriously, though: the first time I heard "Beat It" on the radio, the DJ actually introduced it as "the new song by Michael Jackson and Eddie Van Halen." But I don't think that EVH had shit to do with that album being as huge as it is, beyond the fact that he laced that song with good guitar (no Eruption).
SCREW THE BRITISH & THEIR COMPULSIVE MUSIC LISTENIN'
:liljohn
yeah me neither. speaking as a white dude who grew up around a lot of other white dudes in the 80s, everyone I know had that album, and it definitely wasn't because of Eddie Van Halen or Paul McCartney.
If this were true, it would be really fucking funny.
plus i'd put day of niagara instead of four violins. and throw on 1/2 gentlemen not beasts.