Should 'Illegals' Get In State Tuition? (NRR)
street_muzik
3,919 Posts
Here in California a lot of institutions accept illegal immigrants as in state, making their tuition a lot cheaper. Some people are mad because Americans from other states don't get a break. I'm all for it. You must live in Cali for 1 year to get resident status. If an illegal immigrant has been here more than a year then why not? They most likely are working, paying taxes, supporting the local economy, etc. Discuss.
Comments
No problem here.
6 pager?
Shit, I'm barely breaking even now, been paying my federal taxes to the gub'ment since I was 18, and I've paid my way through all my schooling up until last semester when I was finally old enough to qualify for some sort of finacial aid. If folks want a money break here and are looking for a shortcut than they get nothing but a "fuck you try again"
I think of it as a person who is unrecognized as a citizen and has no proper visa to be in the country.
just to save the causeheads from jumping down my throat I am all for giving healthcare and public schooling up til 12th grade, and job training. But I am in that boat now of trying to make ends meet, work a full time job and pay my way through school. I find it really hard to give someone an easy ride to something I've shed blood sweat and tears over to earn.
If an American citizen goes to South America, Europe, Canada, Asia, etc.....do they get automatic free public education and health care???
Nope. Isn't America great?
Maybe I'm wrong in this, but I thought Venezuela gave free public school education to its citizens? If they don't its a shame, thats a pretty well off country
It's just as I suspected....this free education and health care for illegals is just a ploy to lure unsuspecting people here so we can abuse their civil rights, toture them and get more victims for the death penalty!!
School is really cheap in Mexico if you can pass the entrance exam and have some political ties. Americans can go for the same price as mexicans. Almost free so you are wrong Rockadelic. The Universidad National Autonima de Mexico (UNAM) turns away 10's of thousands of of qualifying students each year. That's the problem, not enough seats.
BTW, Rockadelic, we are talking about in-state tuition, not free.
You may be right guzzo
I work with a Peruvian NGO and kids from the shantytown might get free schooling but the school is from 7-1pm and its quality is seriously lacking
I was more commenting on the health care and pretty much all public services being mad privatised
Philip Oxhorn has written interesting pieces on this subject (pluralism concept)
my organization
Other than sales tax.....how can an illegal alien be "paying taxes"???
"I am all for giving healthcare and public schooling up til 12th grade"
I was responding to the above
I am for this because it is for the greater good of the nation to give these services to illegals. Having disease ridden people walking about without any treatment is pretty inhumane. As for the schooling, none of those "legal" 5- 17 year olds are paying federal taxes either so you can't fault the kids for the choices of the parents.
Even cops support this mentality. It keeps the kids off the streets and out of trouble. As for the "other than sales tax" question, I only speak from what I've seen. As a wage worker most my life, I've worked with and been friends with quite a few "illegals" . Not all of them work under the counter. Many use fake social security cards and pay taxes, never to file for a return. I have no idea the percentage of under the counter to over the counter "illegal" workers. That would be an interesting study, if there was a way to find out.
I don't disagree...I was just curious if any other country does this??
je te donne des props, mon gars. c'est du boulot important.
Gotcha.
Uhh, thats great if you wanna have a practice in Mexico...
I think you will find most of western Europe does this and we don't execute people either !
They actually have good accredited universities. Most professional Mexicans stay in Mexico. They are not the super poor who come here in search of jobs. I know because my dad and family are middle class Mexicans. Yes, contrary to popular belief, Mexico has a middle class.
It's pointless anyway because that's not what we were talking about. He asked if other countries gave free health care or education to non citizens, not the quality of said institutions. If it wasn't for the corruption of the upper class, mexico could be a first world country. We benefit from them staying 3rd world. (cheap labor/imports/exports). I think they are our second biggest trading partner.
as a youngin living in Ecuador, there was free public education. Thing was, the schools where horribly maintained and unless you where living in extreme poverty, you where not attending these schools.
Private schools (mostly Catholic Schools) where way more affordable then here in the states. So lets say, a family who couldnt afford a car, would still have there child in a private school. But then a lot of these private schools where nothing to write home about, they where hardly a step up from public schools.
Of course, for the upper middle and wealthy families, there where nicer private schools.
From what i have scene and have been told, it is similar in Venezuela.
I only bring it up because... Being Canadian (Who's either lived/worked/school in the US, Europe & Mexico) I know one of the huge problems we have right now are telling the world that you can come to Canada if you are a professional, only to have said professionals end up as taxi drivers instead of landing jobs in their field of profession. Its not a good look... And it's getting worse. And part of it is, most companies don't wanna hire someone who's got a degree from anywhere unless it's the US, Canada or some European countries. It's sad, but that a fact.
Also, from my time of going to school in the US and being around a huge amount of International students. The amount of people at the schools from other countries is amazing. Even from places that pay for a Uni education (Finland, Saudi Arabia, etc). They all say the same thing. They all want a US degree. Some because it can help land them jobs in the US and then maybe a green card, or just the fact that the american degree means more in their own country.
And no, Canada doesnt give free health care, unless you've been a resident of the province for a certain amount of time. Can't remember how long that is tho off hand.
And co-sign on the fact that a lot of these folk actually do pay income taxes but they can't collect a return because their SSN is bogus. If the gov't needs to kick anyone off the federal $$$ teat, it's fucking big business, the most notorious welfare recipients of all.
This is changing:
Mission Sucre
Mission Ribas
Mission Robinson I & II
As regards healthcare:
Mission Barrio Adentro
About the topic at hand, my 2 cents:
Perhaps they should work on having a standardized tution cost across the country? That way, your grades would determine which school you get into and not how much money you have. Although it doesn't solve the problems of kids with rich parents who don't need part-time jobs and loans while going to school, it is a step forward and alleviates the problem of state-to-state tuition rate problems (for residents and illegals).
The Immigration and Naturalization system needs some updating.It's hobbling along.
Big business is who benefits from illegal/undocumented workers the most(low pay/no protection).
And I don't agree that undocumented residents should recieve benefits period. It's a catch-22 to be sure. The system is there for a reason, but it is broken and does not properly fulfill it's function. Problems all around. The same situation that many illegal workers leave(no work, poor housing, no opportunity) to come to America for is often re-created wherever the settle.There is no social machinery in place to acclimate them to the US. If I knew how to create a situation that could benefit all parties I would run for office, but I don't.
I see several families every week at the hospital I work at who can't speak an OUNCE of English.5-year olds who do all the talking for Mom. It's sad. People who have been here(according to medical records)often for YEARS. No SS#s, addresses that shift regularly. How is the system helping them by keeping them underground and insular? If they are going to be citizens, they need to go through that channel, for their own benefit and their adopted US communities.
Go ahead and hat on me, but it's a very complex problem that affects everyone in the US, period.