Have to say though when that High Potent shit dropped the flows were like nothing I???d heard before. Hard to believe they record it in 85!!!!
I probably mentioned before that John Peel used to play the HP Get Busy track, and my tape of it got stolen shortly after recording it. Well I saw the guy who stole it off me recently, he???s now a smack head begging on the street. Just seemed weird, we used to hang out with him and shit..
Big_Stacks"I don't worry about hittin' power, cause I don't give 'em nuttin' to hit." 4,670 Posts
Oliver, thanks for that it was ill. I just wanted to say that while I'm considered a bitter old school dude by a lot of people, the funny thing about this entire thread is that Jaz talks about irony and how Ice T ends up playing a cop etc. etc. and how when your doing a lot of things (magazine covers, mtv, etc.) the public perseves you as "HOT" although you may or not be. I have always since day one been a fan of Jaz O. I agree with his interview 100% and just think it's the truth and doesn't sound bitter to me at all. Now the irony of it is how the younger soulstrut cats just continue to talk shit about Jaz O & Premier, two very outstanding talented cats in hip hop and these two are not considered "HOT" any longer because they are not in the limelight as they once were. This still does not make them wack, etc. However the majority of the soul strut posters seem to think so! Once again my 2 cents and just my opinion. I love Jay Z to death and he rips it each and every time and carries himself with a lot of dignity. There was another dude named Jay T that was also, down with these guys that moved from marcy to Seattle back around the late 80's. I met this dude hustling on the streets downtown trying to sell me a fake gold chain! I told him it might work for 99% of these lames but you can't hustle a hustler and we hit it off and became friends. Back then he would tell me stories of Jaz, Jay Z and even the original 50 cent Kelvin Martin. I know about infamous dudes like Phat Cat etc. This is when all this going on. I remember going to a music convention and this guy from EMI was saying how Jaz O's record deal was just crazy like he had some clause that stated he must get new pairs of sneakers every single week! This dude I feel really was ahead of his time and yes he did put Jay Z on for sure. I can assure you that being ahead of your time does no good at all what so ever. I just want to say Props to Jaz O.
This may be strange, but Oliver's post rings eerily similar to Shuggie Otis's fate (e.g., mis-marketed by his label but uniquely talented). Some guys just come out too soon, before the society's musical tastes have caught onto them. Jaz-O was definitely on-point as an artist and in his commentary of today's hip-hop scene.
He can say what he wants, he's done more than most on here... It's his entitlement.
There seems to be a theme, Premier, The Jaz, Marley... They've all been in this scene for years..doing stuff.
We may not all agree with everything they say, but they have the history to back it up as opposed to most of us.
I wonder how many here would actually step to any of them & say...'You suck!'
Or would you all pansy out & want to have a subtle dickriding discussion instead.
How many of you would big up an obscure funk artist/s who only made one record, yet be so quick to diss someone who has made more..including a neglected classic like, 'To Your Soul'?
Amazing.
I just downloaded that 'Laffy Taffy' song, because I had no idea what it was...
Hmmn,..Sounds like a lot of that stuff..but that really cheap sounding keyboard kills me.
Jaz-O is cool. I mean, its not like he dropped classic after classic or anything.
Im not gonna sit here and knock him because hes not on TRL or cause hes probably 40+.
You guys really believe all that though? LIke how 3 six mafia is ripping him off and shit?
I can see where alot of old school guys that did alot for hip hop get shit on by the kids today, and I think thats good reason to be pissed. But I think the attitude that alot of the old school guys have is partly to blame.
From the looks of this thread, jaz-o still has plenty of people that will check for him. Will he be #1 on trl? No. Does that make him any less of an artist? No. Still, if he went back to the lab and cooked up a quality indie album, I bet people would go out and buy it.
Look at MF doom. I mean, hes an old school cat. But he came back with something fresh. Not something intentionally NEW sounding per say, but he kept it original, and thus he found his audience. ANd if you look into his story, its more of an industry nightmare than most of these dudes! Yet you never hear him shitting on D4L or anything. He just gets in where he fits in. And makes a DAMN good living at it too!
It sounds to me like jaz-o is way to concerned with fitting in with what the kids think is hot right now and not focussed enough on what he himself might add to hip hop today.
Now if the musics not in you anymore, thats one thing, and that probably sucks. But when i hear most of these old school cats come back out they just sound confused. I think if alot of them took their own advice however, and were less concerned themselves with their image and what people think about them, we'd probably get some better music.
Hip hop is very big and there is room for many people to eat! He should be happy to get a deal with kotch! not pissed cause hes not running the game. If you think about it, theres really no good reason to sit around being bitter. Its not getting anyone anywhere.
much respect to Jaz O! I've always been a big fan of his since the "music I believe in" days (I didn't hear the HP joint to later on...). I also always felt he got slept on. Stuff he was doing on "To The Soul" and "It Don't Stop" were amazing as a lyricist. The cadence, style, word play, and rhyme schemes are equalled by very very few.
In the end, hip-hop rewards the innovators rather than originators. It's not what you start: it's what you do with it.
I don't know if I would say that it "consistently" rewards either. I think some people reap the benefits and others do not and there is a variety of factors that go into play to why that is. I don't think there are any concrete answers here. I guess the main consistent thing is that if the innovatative or original person didn't have someone behind them that knew how to work the business and believed in them then they didn't reap the benefits or not as much as those who did. For the most part at least....
DocMcCoy"Go and laugh in your own country!" 5,913 Posts
In the end, hip-hop rewards the innovators rather than originators. It's not what you start: it's what you do with it.
Does it, though? The history of music is littered with examples of people who opened the door and were left holding the handle. There are plenty of old-school cats who were both innovators and originators, and they're not making half the living off this shit that the people who bit their style or piggybacked their careers are. I mean, I still come across people with more than a passing interest in rap who are surprised to learn that "Rapper's Delight" is jacked from a Grandmaster Caz routine. Master Don died broke while Master P cleaned up. In many respects, that's the nature of the game, and complaining about it is only going to do so much good. There's a touch of "Salieri vs. Mozart" about that Jaz-0 interview and, if I were him, I don't know that I could be mad at Jay-Z for bringing something to the party that set him apart from everyone else in the game. He did that with "Reasonable Doubt" and, a few stutter steps along the way notwithstanding, he's continued to do it.
As for rewarding the originators, I know some of you guys like to clown the way Europeans, Antipodeans and Japanese venerate some of the old-school cats, who probably couldn't eat if they had to rely on America for a living. I have mixed feelings about hip-hop nostalgia, because I'm as interested in the new as much as I am the shit I grew up listening to, but I do believe there ought to be a way for the people who helped build this shit to be able to eat off it. There often seems to be a lot of mediocre talents making superstar money in hip-hop but that's true everywhere right now. Given Jaz-0's pedigree, I can't see how he wouldn't be able to find an audience for what he's doing. It might not be the audience he'd like - it can't be a whole lot of fun being a prophet without honour in your own country, while you watch your boy get given the keys to the kingdom - but he wouldn't be starving. It could be a lot worse.
The game owes me something,[/b] and that's why I got the right to say what I want to say.
I find this attitude to be foul... if he wants to speak on 'the game' he oughta know that you get your year, three years, or whatever on top and you capitalize on that shit as best you can at the time... thats the game... the game is not whining about how you should've gotten more ten years later...
I'm with Bsides- if dude can get a decent indie label contract and sell some records and get a good amount of dough out of it, he really needs to be pleased with that... thats more than a lot of folks get, especially so long after their hitmaking years...
The game owes me something,[/b] and that's why I got the right to say what I want to say.
I find this attitude to be foul... if he wants to speak on 'the game' he oughta know that you get your year, three years, or whatever on top and you capitalize on that shit as best you can at the time... thats the game... the game is not whining about how you should've gotten more ten years later...
I'm with Bsides- if dude can get a decent indie label contract and sell some records and get a good amount of dough out of it, he really needs to be pleased with that... thats more than a lot of folks get, especially so long after their hitmaking years...
But:
He was the first ni66a to put an animal on his album cover!
Comments
Hard to believe they record it in 85!!!!
I probably mentioned before that John Peel used to play the HP Get Busy track, and my tape of it got stolen shortly after recording it.
Well I saw the guy who stole it off me recently, he???s now a smack head begging on the street.
Just seemed weird, we used to hang out with him and shit..
This may be strange, but Oliver's post rings eerily similar to Shuggie Otis's fate (e.g., mis-marketed by his label but uniquely talented). Some guys just come out too soon, before the society's musical tastes have caught onto them. Jaz-O was definitely on-point as an artist and in his commentary of today's hip-hop scene.
Peace,
Big Stacks from Kakalak
He can say what he wants, he's done more than most on here... It's his entitlement.
There seems to be a theme, Premier, The Jaz, Marley... They've all been in this scene for years..doing stuff.
We may not all agree with everything they say, but they have the history to back it up as opposed to most of us.
I wonder how many here would actually step to any of them & say...'You suck!'
Or would you all pansy out & want to have a subtle dickriding discussion instead.
How many of you would big up an obscure funk artist/s who only made one record, yet be so quick to diss someone who has made more..including a neglected classic like, 'To Your Soul'?
Amazing.
I just downloaded that 'Laffy Taffy' song, because I had no idea what it was...
Hmmn,..Sounds like a lot of that stuff..but that really cheap sounding keyboard kills me.
That can't be a hit...surely not...
Im not gonna sit here and knock him because hes not on TRL or cause hes probably 40+.
You guys really believe all that though? LIke how 3 six mafia is ripping him off and shit?
I can see where alot of old school guys that did alot for hip hop get shit on by the kids today, and I think thats good reason to be pissed. But I think the attitude that alot of the old school guys have is partly to blame.
From the looks of this thread, jaz-o still has plenty of people that will check for him. Will he be #1 on trl? No. Does that make him any less of an artist? No. Still, if he went back to the lab and cooked up a quality indie album, I bet people would go out and buy it.
Look at MF doom. I mean, hes an old school cat. But he came back with something fresh. Not something intentionally NEW sounding per say, but he kept it original, and thus he found his audience. ANd if you look into his story, its more of an industry nightmare than most of these dudes! Yet you never hear him shitting on D4L or anything. He just gets in where he fits in. And makes a DAMN good living at it too!
It sounds to me like jaz-o is way to concerned with fitting in with what the kids think is hot right now and not focussed enough on what he himself might add to hip hop today.
Now if the musics not in you anymore, thats one thing, and that probably sucks. But when i hear most of these old school cats come back out they just sound confused. I think if alot of them took their own advice however, and were less concerned themselves with their image and what people think about them, we'd probably get some better music.
Hip hop is very big and there is room for many people to eat! He should be happy to get a deal with kotch! not pissed cause hes not running the game. If you think about it, theres really no good reason to sit around being bitter. Its not getting anyone anywhere.
I don't know if I would say that it "consistently" rewards either. I think some people reap the benefits and others do not and there is a variety of factors that go into play to why that is. I don't think there are any concrete answers here. I guess the main consistent thing is that if the innovatative or original person didn't have someone behind them that knew how to work the business and believed in them then they didn't reap the benefits or not as much as those who did. For the most part at least....
Does it, though? The history of music is littered with examples of people who opened the door and were left holding the handle. There are plenty of old-school cats who were both innovators and originators, and they're not making half the living off this shit that the people who bit their style or piggybacked their careers are. I mean, I still come across people with more than a passing interest in rap who are surprised to learn that "Rapper's Delight" is jacked from a Grandmaster Caz routine. Master Don died broke while Master P cleaned up. In many respects, that's the nature of the game, and complaining about it is only going to do so much good. There's a touch of "Salieri vs. Mozart" about that Jaz-0 interview and, if I were him, I don't know that I could be mad at Jay-Z for bringing something to the party that set him apart from everyone else in the game. He did that with "Reasonable Doubt" and, a few stutter steps along the way notwithstanding, he's continued to do it.
As for rewarding the originators, I know some of you guys like to clown the way Europeans, Antipodeans and Japanese venerate some of the old-school cats, who probably couldn't eat if they had to rely on America for a living. I have mixed feelings about hip-hop nostalgia, because I'm as interested in the new as much as I am the shit I grew up listening to, but I do believe there ought to be a way for the people who helped build this shit to be able to eat off it. There often seems to be a lot of mediocre talents making superstar money in hip-hop but that's true everywhere right now. Given Jaz-0's pedigree, I can't see how he wouldn't be able to find an audience for what he's doing. It might not be the audience he'd like - it can't be a whole lot of fun being a prophet without honour in your own country, while you watch your boy get given the keys to the kingdom - but he wouldn't be starving. It could be a lot worse.
I find this attitude to be foul... if he wants to speak on 'the game' he oughta know that you get your year, three years, or whatever on top and you capitalize on that shit as best you can at the time... thats the game... the game is not whining about how you should've gotten more ten years later...
I'm with Bsides- if dude can get a decent indie label contract and sell some records and get a good amount of dough out of it, he really needs to be pleased with that... thats more than a lot of folks get, especially so long after their hitmaking years...
But: