So, the area erupted. Actaully, it has receieved very little attention in the city when I was there. I didnt see it in any of the newspapers. I
i guess you left Paris just when the riots started, because it's definitely beeing covered in every newspaper, Tv, radio, website etc I can think of since saturday. On every talk show you have debates with social workers, police unions and government representative coming to give their opinion. It's like saying that Katrina didn't receive attention in America.
If you want my opinion the problem is that since Sarkozy is running for President and is quite popular, the cops feel like they have been given the green light to do whatever they want, because they know Sarkozy will support them. Cops almost never go to jail for killing people in France.
lot of Paris' real problems have been marginilized and pushed out of the center. The old city feels almost like a midieval walled city, with all of the undesireables on the outside.
that basically sums it up. i've lived half my life in paris (13eme, near ave gobelins, blvd st. marcel). it's become horribly expensive to live there and if you don't own your apt or rent it through family/friends, you'll be living in poverty (for example, across the hall from my place, there was a family of six or so senegalese immigrants living in a 1 bedroom or studio apartment...no toilet or shower in their apartment either, there was a communal one in the hall way for the other studios on the hall).
needless to say, the outskirts of paris (either the edge of the city itself or the suburbs) are populated with poor immigrant populations which are basically lumped into housing projects where the police don't even show up half the time they're called...the mentality is "let's group em all together and they'll kill themselves off eventually".
let's not forget either that 20% of the french population voted for the extreme right national front party in the last election.
hey, you cold easily replace 'Paris' with 'manhattan' in this whole paragraph.
lot of Paris' real problems have been marginilized and pushed out of the center. The old city feels almost like a midieval walled city, with all of the undesireables on the outside.
that basically sums it up. i've lived half my life in paris (13eme, near ave gobelins, blvd st. marcel). it's become horribly expensive to live there and if you don't own your apt or rent it through family/friends, you'll be living in poverty (for example, across the hall from my place, there was a family of six or so senegalese immigrants living in a 1 bedroom or studio apartment...no toilet or shower in their apartment either, there was a communal one in the hall way for the other studios on the hall).
needless to say, the outskirts of paris (either the edge of the city itself or the suburbs) are populated with poor immigrant populations which are basically lumped into housing projects where the police don't even show up half the time they're called...the mentality is "let's group em all together and they'll kill themselves off eventually".
let's not forget either that 20% of the french population voted for the extreme right national front party in the last election.
hey, you cold easily replace 'Paris' with 'manhattan' in this whole paragraph.
yeah true, although you don't have the islamic fundamentalists setting up shop in ny projects to spread a hateful doctrine which completely reverses any attempt that these communities make to integrate (whether they are helped by the french govt or not) themselves into french culture. but that's a whole other thread in itself.
Disabled Woman Set Ablaze Updated: 12:36, Friday November 04, 2005
A handicapped woman was doused with petrol and set on fire by youths during another night of rioting in Paris.
The 56-year-old suffered third degree burns to 20% of her body in the attack.
Witnesses said a youth poured petrol over the woman and then threw a Molotov cocktail on to the bus she was travelling on in the suburb of Sevran.
Other passengers were able to flee but she was unable to escape because of her disabilities.
It was the worst incident so far in more than a week of rioting.
For the first time, there were also signs of copycat rampages elsewhere in France.
Police said several cars in the eastern city of Dijon were set alight, while similar attacks took place in the western Seine-Maritime region and the Bouches-du-Rhone in the south of the country.
More than 160 cars were reportedly torched in the Paris region, as well as 33 in the provinces.
But police said the night seemed calmer than the one before, when 315 vehicles were burnt in the Ile-de-France region around the capital.
Buses, fire engines and police were again stoned in the Paris suburbs, with five policemen reported slightly injured.
However, there were fewer direct confrontations between police and "troublemakers".
One of the worst incidents took place at Neuilly-sur-Marne where police vans came under fire from pellet pistols, but nobody was hurt.
Neuilly-sur-Marne is in the worst-hit northeastern region of Seine-Saint-Denis, where 1,300 officers were deployed, and more than 30 people were arrested there and elsewhere.
The rioting is a direct challenge to the authority of the French government and to Prime Minister Dominique de Villepin in particular.
On Thursday he told parliament authorities "will not give in" to the violence and will make restoring order their "absolute top priority".
Disabled Woman Set Ablaze Updated: 12:36, Friday November 04, 2005
A handicapped woman was doused with petrol and set on fire by youths during another night of rioting in Paris.
The 56-year-old suffered third degree burns to 20% of her body in the attack.
Witnesses said a youth poured petrol over the woman and then threw a Molotov cocktail on to the bus she was travelling on in the suburb of Sevran.
Other passengers were able to flee but she was unable to escape because of her disabilities.
It was the worst incident so far in more than a week of rioting.
For the first time, there were also signs of copycat rampages elsewhere in France.
Police said several cars in the eastern city of Dijon were set alight, while similar attacks took place in the western Seine-Maritime region and the Bouches-du-Rhone in the south of the country.
More than 160 cars were reportedly torched in the Paris region, as well as 33 in the provinces.
But police said the night seemed calmer than the one before, when 315 vehicles were burnt in the Ile-de-France region around the capital.
Buses, fire engines and police were again stoned in the Paris suburbs, with five policemen reported slightly injured.
However, there were fewer direct confrontations between police and "troublemakers".
One of the worst incidents took place at Neuilly-sur-Marne where police vans came under fire from pellet pistols, but nobody was hurt.
Neuilly-sur-Marne is in the worst-hit northeastern region of Seine-Saint-Denis, where 1,300 officers were deployed, and more than 30 people were arrested there and elsewhere.
The rioting is a direct challenge to the authority of the French government and to Prime Minister Dominique de Villepin in particular.
On Thursday he told parliament authorities "will not give in" to the violence and will make restoring order their "absolute top priority".
Jesus! this does no good to anybody. The authorities will turn giuliani on their asses and mad repression is coming. Sarko's comments are now justified. I mean this is only good for the FN giving examples of deliquence. For more stringent police intervention in the cites and more flexible arrests regulations. Nothing will be gained for the empoverished side in this riot/not protest and it will make the hood look even worse. Shit's hit the fan big time
The rioting is a direct challenge to the authority of the French government and to Prime Minister Dominique de Villepin in particular.
On Thursday he told parliament authorities "will not give in" to the violence and will make restoring order their "absolute top priority".
good to know they're not going to deal with the cause and just put a nice big shiny band-aid on it instead.
Co sign
Civil society had a chance to make themselves heard after those project-fire incidents earlier this year the public/media was on there side its all over now.
spawning copycats
Bound to happen in a place full-of something to prove youths with real reasons to have hate. A window to express it. Jesus to think i was going to be studying there this year
True. Imagine your walking at night with a group of friends and you see a cop beating up on your friend there's rocks lying around and you have the freedom for once to go at it..Shit! Cops versus gang of youths has civil war written all over it...usually
Imagine your walking at night with a group of friends and you see a cop beating up on your friend there's rocks lying around and you have the freedom for once to go at it..Shit! Cops versus gang of youths has civil war written all over it...usually
the freedom to light cripple old ladies on fire. exercise it!
Imagine your walking at night with a group of friends and you see a cop beating up on your friend there's rocks lying around and you have the freedom for once to go at it..Shit! Cops versus gang of youths has civil war written all over it...usually
the freedom to light cripple old ladies on fire. exercise it!
the freedom to refer to people as cripples. exercise it!
What y'all are witnessing (beside bad media coverage and amplified rumors) is politricking at his highest level. And furthermore, y'all are witnessing the impact of U.S.A. on political strategies...but let me dig deeper. We got this dude named Nicolas Sarkozy...he's a young arrogant dude, from the last generation. He studied in America and is very very admirative of people like Guliani. He stated one day that he really liked the way he "cleaned" New-York. Now remember this sentence, this is important to understand what's happening in Paris... Dude studied the mechanics of the now infamous "zero tolerance" theory. He saw the benefits of it while travelling back and forth in U.S.A., doing conferences in Universities at the same time. The "broken window" theory was explained to him...They even explained him the ins and outs of affirmative action. He translated it as "positive discrimination"...trickery.
It's been a couple of years he's showing interest for being President until he clearly said it last year. Since then, he's playing chess. But dude is powerful...don't let his midget look fool you. He voted a law against cumulating jobs and then flipped the script by now cumulating 4 jobs at the same time. He got the country shook. And he decided to take it further. Guliani style. Remember when he arrived in N.Y. and decided to clean the center to push the "dirt" in the burbs. Well, that's what's happening rite now. Dude went himself, with security and shit, to so-called talk to the people while T.V. and radio was filming and recording. He purposedly used some words to trigger the audience...Sentences like "i know y'all are tired of these thugs", "y'all are tired of being scared by the same group of delinquants hangin outside all day, driving cars that y'all will never be able to afford, [...] so we are going to investigate on people and ask each one how they can afford thousands euros cars when they don't have a job", etc...
The crowd went ill...as the few racists in the audience was rejoicing to hear a super-hero politician talking about "cleaning the hood" (remember Guliani...), some people (the teenagers mostly) went crazy and started to fuck around...Some kids got scared and ran away from Po-Po, hide in some electric closets and fuckin electrocute themselves. Two kids died. Now the whole project where they are from started to fuck around wit the cops. They called the SWAT team on their azz (our equivalent)...then they started to burn down cars, garbage cans and so on. Remember it's only kids that really participate. Now since there's a huge media coverage of that...They see all these kids on T.V. wilding out. That gave ideas to other kids in other projects. Something like 9 hoods started to fuck around wit cops and firemen (yes, they do consider firemen as cops here). 9 hoods out of 150, it's not riots. It's some mini-strikes. Like kids are on strike. they don't wanna play the game anymore. That's mostly why the police is stuck : because it's some kids running around, hiding from buildings to buildings. They can't fuck up kids like that...They woud trigger a bigger rebellion and extend the movement. And maybe involve the adults. Adding the fact that some grenades was thrown at a Mosque, and you have all the ingredients to start some shit in France. As it was stated above, French was the one raising hell for the vail in public schools. We don't know how to deal with minorities because we never apologized and explained what happened...They swept everything under the rug...So that's what you get 40 years after. Conflicts.
We got this dude named Nicolas Sarkozy...he's a young arrogant dude, from the last generation. He studied in America and is very very admirative of people like Guliani. He stated one day that he really liked the way he "cleaned" New-York. Now remember this sentence, this is important to understand what's happening in Paris... Dude studied the mechanics of the now infamous "zero tolerance" theory. He saw the benefits of it while travelling back and forth in U.S.A., doing conferences in Universities at the same time. The "broken window" theory was explained to him...They even explained him the ins and outs of affirmative action. He translated it as "positive discrimination"...trickery.
Absolutely
Jesus! this does no good to anybody. The authorities will turn giuliani on their asses and mad repression is coming. Sarko's comments are now justified
Unfortunately it is so true and neither side will let up. Except one gains while the other loses. If sarko get some right wing votes with this, its over.
Comments
this is real. I can say having lived there that the cops are bad. but the REAL fascists are the CRS. they usually come out for the demonstrations.
If you want my opinion the problem is that since Sarkozy is running for President and is quite popular, the cops feel like they have been given the green light to do whatever they want, because they know Sarkozy will support them. Cops almost never go to jail for killing people in France.
hey, you cold easily replace 'Paris' with 'manhattan' in this whole paragraph.
7 nights strong the kids keep on hittin the streets. Sarko`s comments wolnt hlep
Soundtrack to the riots
yeah true, although you don't have the islamic fundamentalists setting up shop in ny projects to spread a hateful doctrine which completely reverses any attempt that these communities make to integrate (whether they are helped by the french govt or not) themselves into french culture. but that's a whole other thread in itself.
Updated: 12:36, Friday November 04, 2005
A handicapped woman was doused with petrol and set on fire by youths during another night of rioting in Paris.
The 56-year-old suffered third degree burns to 20% of her body in the attack.
Witnesses said a youth poured petrol over the woman and then threw a Molotov cocktail on to the bus she was travelling on in the suburb of Sevran.
Other passengers were able to flee but she was unable to escape because of her disabilities.
It was the worst incident so far in more than a week of rioting.
For the first time, there were also signs of copycat rampages elsewhere in France.
Police said several cars in the eastern city of Dijon were set alight, while similar attacks took place in the western Seine-Maritime region and the Bouches-du-Rhone in the south of the country.
More than 160 cars were reportedly torched in the Paris region, as well as 33 in the provinces.
But police said the night seemed calmer than the one before, when 315 vehicles were burnt in the Ile-de-France region around the capital.
Buses, fire engines and police were again stoned in the Paris suburbs, with five policemen reported slightly injured.
However, there were fewer direct confrontations between police and "troublemakers".
One of the worst incidents took place at Neuilly-sur-Marne where police vans came under fire from pellet pistols, but nobody was hurt.
Neuilly-sur-Marne is in the worst-hit northeastern region of Seine-Saint-Denis, where 1,300 officers were deployed, and more than 30 people were arrested there and elsewhere.
The rioting is a direct challenge to the authority of the French government and to Prime Minister Dominique de Villepin in particular.
On Thursday he told parliament authorities "will not give in" to the violence and will make restoring order their "absolute top priority".
Jesus! this does no good to anybody. The authorities will turn giuliani on their asses and mad repression is coming. Sarko's comments are now justified.
I mean this is only good for the FN giving examples of deliquence. For more stringent police intervention in the cites and more flexible arrests regulations.
Nothing will be gained for the empoverished side in this riot/not protest and it will make the hood look even worse.
Shit's hit the fan big time
good to know they're not going to deal with the cause and just put a nice big shiny band-aid on it instead.
Civil society had a chance to make themselves heard after those project-fire incidents earlier this year the public/media was on there side its all over now.
Bound to happen in a place full-of something to prove youths with real reasons to have hate. A window to express it. Jesus to think i was going to be studying there this year
Imagine your walking at night with a group of friends and you see a cop beating up on your friend there's rocks lying around and you have the freedom for once to go at it..Shit!
Cops versus gang of youths has civil war written all over it...usually
the freedom to light cripple old ladies on fire. exercise it!
the freedom to refer to people as cripples. exercise it!
What y'all are witnessing (beside bad media coverage and amplified rumors) is politricking at his highest level. And furthermore, y'all are witnessing the impact of U.S.A. on political strategies...but let me dig deeper.
We got this dude named Nicolas Sarkozy...he's a young arrogant dude, from the last generation. He studied in America and is very very admirative of people like Guliani. He stated one day that he really liked the way he "cleaned" New-York. Now remember this sentence, this is important to understand what's happening in Paris...
Dude studied the mechanics of the now infamous "zero tolerance" theory. He saw the benefits of it while travelling back and forth in U.S.A., doing conferences in Universities at the same time. The "broken window" theory was explained to him...They even explained him the ins and outs of affirmative action. He translated it as "positive discrimination"...trickery.
It's been a couple of years he's showing interest for being President until he clearly said it last year. Since then, he's playing chess. But dude is powerful...don't let his midget look fool you. He voted a law against cumulating jobs and then flipped the script by now cumulating 4 jobs at the same time. He got the country shook. And he decided to take it further. Guliani style. Remember when he arrived in N.Y. and decided to clean the center to push the "dirt" in the burbs. Well, that's what's happening rite now.
Dude went himself, with security and shit, to so-called talk to the people while T.V. and radio was filming and recording. He purposedly used some words to trigger the audience...Sentences like "i know y'all are tired of these thugs", "y'all are tired of being scared by the same group of delinquants hangin outside all day, driving cars that y'all will never be able to afford, [...] so we are going to investigate on people and ask each one how they can afford thousands euros cars when they don't have a job", etc...
The crowd went ill...as the few racists in the audience was rejoicing to hear a super-hero politician talking about "cleaning the hood" (remember Guliani...), some people (the teenagers mostly) went crazy and started to fuck around...Some kids got scared and ran away from Po-Po, hide in some electric closets and fuckin electrocute themselves. Two kids died. Now the whole project where they are from started to fuck around wit the cops. They called the SWAT team on their azz (our equivalent)...then they started to burn down cars, garbage cans and so on. Remember it's only kids that really participate. Now since there's a huge media coverage of that...They see all these kids on T.V. wilding out. That gave ideas to other kids in other projects. Something like 9 hoods started to fuck around wit cops and firemen (yes, they do consider firemen as cops here). 9 hoods out of 150, it's not riots. It's some mini-strikes. Like kids are on strike. they don't wanna play the game anymore. That's mostly why the police is stuck : because it's some kids running around, hiding from buildings to buildings. They can't fuck up kids like that...They woud trigger a bigger rebellion and extend the movement. And maybe involve the adults. Adding the fact that some grenades was thrown at a Mosque, and you have all the ingredients to start some shit in France.
As it was stated above, French was the one raising hell for the vail in public schools. We don't know how to deal with minorities because we never apologized and explained what happened...They swept everything under the rug...So that's what you get 40 years after. Conflicts.
Absolutely
Unfortunately it is so true and neither side will let up. Except one gains while the other loses. If sarko get some right wing votes with this, its over.