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Scorpio & His People?

fryer_motherfunkfryer_motherfunk 123 Posts
edited October 2010 in Strut Central
I see this getting so much love everywhere, i don't get it. it's rare yes, the label is cool yes, but its pretty average once you take of the rarity goggles. What am i missing?
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  Comments

  • leonleon 883 Posts
    Cannot you see
    It is Top Hit USA

    b/w

    I think there's a discussion about rare/value going on right now in the ' is there any record ' thread.
  • mannybolonemannybolone Los Angeles, CA 15,025 Posts
    fryer_motherfunk said:
    I see this getting so much love everywhere, i don't get it. it's rare yes, the label is cool yes, but its pretty average once you take of the rarity goggles. What am i missing?

    I'd say it's considerably more interesting than being "pretty average."

    Assuming you're asking your question sincerely, I'll give this an earnest swing:

    *That opening riff/motif is hard as nails.
    *The distinctive prominence of the 16th notes on the ride cymbal.
    *The rhythmic swing of the two-note tuba puffs.
    *The weird, androgynous vocals.
    *The space between he/her singing "oh baby....oh darling" filled by the aforementioned motif.
    *The building, racing tension on the bridge.
    *The perfect assemblage of all the above.

    Regardless of its rarity or how much the single goes for, I think it's an awesome tune, but of course, issues like these are always in the ear of the beholder.
  • The-gafflerThe-gaffler 2,190 Posts
    hey guys, there is a song some people like, but it find it boring. why do people like music i find out of my taste?
  • fryer_motherfunkfryer_motherfunk 123 Posts
    The-gaffler said:
    hey guys, there is a song some people like, but it find it boring. why do people like music i find out of my taste?

    This is a music discussion forum right?
  • fryer_motherfunkfryer_motherfunk 123 Posts
    fryer_motherfunk said:

    *That opening riff/motif is hard as nails.
    *The distinctive prominence of the 16th notes on the ride cymbal.
    *The rhythmic swing of the two-note tuba puffs.
    *The weird, androgynous vocals.
    *The space between he/her singing "oh baby....oh darling" filled by the aforementioned motif.
    *The building, racing tension on the bridge.
    *The perfect assemblage of all the above.

    ill try again but not convinced. They sound like they are falling asleep on the job. Emperors new clothes.
  • fishmongerfunkfishmongerfunk 4,154 Posts
    fryer_motherfunk said:
    Emperors new clothes.

    yeah, all of us who love that track have simply been duped by the sheer hype surrounding its obscurity.
  • mannybolonemannybolone Los Angeles, CA 15,025 Posts
    mannybolone said:
    fryer_motherfunk said:

    *That opening riff/motif is hard as nails.
    *The distinctive prominence of the 16th notes on the ride cymbal.
    *The rhythmic swing of the two-note tuba puffs.
    *The weird, androgynous vocals.
    *The space between he/her singing "oh baby....oh darling" filled by the aforementioned motif.
    *The building, racing tension on the bridge.
    *The perfect assemblage of all the above.

    ill try again but not convinced. They sound like they are falling asleep on the job. Emperors new clothes.

    I'm not trying to convince you. If you don't like it, you don't like it. I like it. What more is there?
  • SoulhawkSoulhawk 3,197 Posts
    one of you is wrong

    let's argue until we resolve this
  • mannybolonemannybolone Los Angeles, CA 15,025 Posts
    Soulhawk said:
    one of you is wrong

    let's argue until we resolve this

    The Soulstrut Way???
  • doisndoisn baleadas&pupuzas 303 Posts
    The Soulstrut Way???


    Hell Yeah! there??s a break on the flip...
  • goodwill_huntinggoodwill_hunting 324 Posts
    saw moerer's auction a while back and finally listened to this turd, this record might be worse than that blackout 70
  • ReynaldoReynaldo 6,054 Posts
    Unfortunately people will never know how much they would have liked the song/45 had it not been mega rare/hyped.
  • parallaxparallax no-style-having mf'er 1,266 Posts
    It's a good track, but there are many better ones. The legend of this 45 is far greater than its actual quality.

    Kindly,
    parallax
  • buttonbutton 1,475 Posts
    Dear Mr. Fryer,

    Dundun dun dun dundun dun, DUN DUN DUN
    +
    "I ask you to give me another chance, but you laugh in my face."

    :balla:

    signed,
    Heard It IRL
  • mannybolonemannybolone Los Angeles, CA 15,025 Posts
    Dundun dun dun dundun dun, DUN DUN DUN
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    Dundun dun dun dundun dun, DUN DUN DUN
    Dundun dun dun dundun dun, DUN DUN DUN
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    Dundun dun dun dundun dun, DUN DUN DUN
    Dundun dun dun dundun dun, DUN DUN DUN
    Dundun dun dun dundun dun, DUN DUN DUN
    Dundun dun dun dundun dun, DUN DUN DUN
    Dundun dun dun dundun dun, DUN DUN DUN
    Dundun dun dun dundun dun, DUN DUN DUN
    Dundun dun dun dundun dun, DUN DUN DUN
    Dundun dun dun dundun dun, DUN DUN DUN
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  • mannybolonemannybolone Los Angeles, CA 15,025 Posts
    parallax said:
    It's a good track, but there are many better ones.

    Name three.

    Genuinely curious, not throwing down thee gauntlet.
  • ReynaldoReynaldo 6,054 Posts


  • parallaxparallax no-style-having mf'er 1,266 Posts
    mannybolone said:
    parallax said:
    It's a good track, but there are many better ones.

    Name three.

    Genuinely curious, not throwing down thee gauntlet.

    Hi Manny,

    Fair enough. So, in no particular order and off the top of my head:

    1984's - There's A Wrinkle In Our Time: Can you imagine if there were only 2 or 3 copies known to exist of this beast? The opening sequence is just bonkers with the count down.

    Sandi & Mateus - The World: We all know this one. It's been played a million times and re-ished, comped, etc. but, again, can you imagine if it had the same story as Scorpio?

    Boris Gardner - Melting Pot: Again, played a gazillion times, comped, re-ished, blah blah blah...but wow...that super heavy bassline, I still get chills when the organ creeps in, those fat drums, the bongos...insane tune when you first heard it, right? But it's so common in the mental rolodex of funk that it doesn't seem THAT special. Well, it is. To me anyway.

    I would also add "Stormy Weather" by Dorsey Brockington as a fourth. The inter-play of the horns, crazy vocals, and "stormy sound effects" are unforgettable.

    I think "Unforgiven" is special. It's raw and heavy, and I agree with all you wrote about it above, Manny. I just honestly believe that the hype, rarity, and stories about acquiring (or almost acquiring) it are greater than the track itself. The crazy stuff Forty Fivan wrote about his offers to DJ OM (lurking related) for the record just works toward solidifying the record's legend. Just my opinion.

    Kindly,
    parallax
  • DJFerrariDJFerrari 2,411 Posts
    I never meant to overhype this record... I certainly think it's beyond killer, but hey... doesn't have to be everyone's sound. I will say that I think it needs to be heard loud and in person to fully appreciate how raw and heavy it is... a 2 minute mp3 sample just doesn't do it justice.

    So my story about offering OM $100 for the mp3 was more of a joke between the two of us than anything... I like to give him a hard time about how protective he is over the record... actually I like to give him a hard time about everything as does he in return :cheese:
  • DCarfagnaDCarfagna 983 Posts
    Dudes, the Scorpio 45 has about 1% of the hype/myth that Salt, Arthur Monday, Apple "Curse" and about a dozen other 45s do. In fact, I think all of the "hype" stemmed from this very site. Just deal with the fact that the Scorpio 45 bangs extremely hard and is also dead rare.
  • parallaxparallax no-style-having mf'er 1,266 Posts
    FortyFivan said:
    I never meant to overhype this record... I certainly think it's beyond killer, but hey... doesn't have to be everyone's sound. I will say that I think it needs to be heard loud and in person to fully appreciate how raw and heavy it is... a 2 minute mp3 sample just doesn't do it justice.

    So my story about offering OM $100 for the mp3 was more of a joke between the two of us than anything... I like to give him a hard time about how protective he is over the record... actually I like to give him a hard time about everything as does he in return :cheese:

    So you're saying you wouldn't pay $100 for a full mp3? ;)

    I think you make a good point about hearing it loud and on vinyl vs mp3. Definitely a killer track--no doubt about that. So, FortyFivan, where does it rank alltime on your funk chart? I'd like Manny's input on this too as I respect both of your tastes in sound.

    Kindly,
    parallax
  • DJFerrariDJFerrari 2,411 Posts
    parallax said:
    FortyFivan said:
    I never meant to overhype this record... I certainly think it's beyond killer, but hey... doesn't have to be everyone's sound. I will say that I think it needs to be heard loud and in person to fully appreciate how raw and heavy it is... a 2 minute mp3 sample just doesn't do it justice.

    So my story about offering OM $100 for the mp3 was more of a joke between the two of us than anything... I like to give him a hard time about how protective he is over the record... actually I like to give him a hard time about everything as does he in return :cheese:

    So you're saying you wouldn't pay $100 for a full mp3? ;)

    I think you make a good point about hearing it loud and on vinyl vs mp3. Definitely a killer track--no doubt about that. So, FortyFivan, where does it rank alltime on your funk chart? I'd like Manny's input on this too as I respect both of your tastes in sound.

    Kindly,
    parallax

    Ha... I dunno... maybe not on principle ;-)

    So I'm terrible at alltime charts because I have many different tastes at different times, but in the raw/heavy funk 45 category, I'd definitely put this at or near the top along with these off the top of my head...

    Fabulous Souls - Take Me
    Universouls - New Generation
    Hebrew Rogers - Can't Buy Soul
    Curtis the Brothers - You Make Everything Better
    Waymond Hall - What Will Tomorrow Bring
    Soul Excitement - Together

    I realize that these are all rare and I only have 3 of these, but I just happen to like this specific rare funk 45 sound... and there is a distinct difference in sound between rare and common funk. My soul 45 alltime chart is definitely more on the common side of things.
  • fryer_motherfunkfryer_motherfunk 123 Posts
    Id agree that Arthur Monday has always been over-hyped, many of the old big "rare" funk records were, but "curse" curls one out on Scorpio and is probably rarer. If i got one cheap id flip it right away.
  • parallaxparallax no-style-having mf'er 1,266 Posts
    FortyFivan said:
    parallax said:
    FortyFivan said:
    I never meant to overhype this record... I certainly think it's beyond killer, but hey... doesn't have to be everyone's sound. I will say that I think it needs to be heard loud and in person to fully appreciate how raw and heavy it is... a 2 minute mp3 sample just doesn't do it justice.

    So my story about offering OM $100 for the mp3 was more of a joke between the two of us than anything... I like to give him a hard time about how protective he is over the record... actually I like to give him a hard time about everything as does he in return :cheese:

    So you're saying you wouldn't pay $100 for a full mp3? ;)

    I think you make a good point about hearing it loud and on vinyl vs mp3. Definitely a killer track--no doubt about that. So, FortyFivan, where does it rank alltime on your funk chart? I'd like Manny's input on this too as I respect both of your tastes in sound.

    Kindly,
    parallax

    Fabulous Souls - Take Me
    Universouls - New Generation
    Hebrew Rogers - Can't Buy Soul
    Curtis the Brothers - You Make Everything Better
    Waymond Hall - What Will Tomorrow Bring
    Soul Excitement - Together


    ^^^
    dope list!

    Kindly,
    parallax
  • SoulhawkSoulhawk 3,197 Posts
    FortyFivan said:
    there is a distinct difference in sound between rare and common funk.

    really?
  • DJFerrariDJFerrari 2,411 Posts
    Soulhawk said:
    FortyFivan said:
    there is a distinct difference in sound between rare and common funk.

    really?

    That may be an over generalization, but I think so. I hate to apply logic considering the basis of that statement is emotional, but under produced, unpolished, emotional funk with room to experiment sounds distinctly different than well produced, polished, formulaic funk. It's the same reason I prefer college basketball over the NBA. Sloppy amateur players with hustle and heart are more entertaining to me than watching the best of the best.
  • z_illaz_illa 867 Posts
    DCarfagna said:
    Dudes, the Scorpio 45 has about 1% of the hype/myth that Salt, Arthur Monday, Apple "Curse" and about a dozen other 45s do. In fact, I think all of the "hype" stemmed from this very site. Just deal with the fact that the Scorpio 45 bangs extremely hard and is also dead rare.

    /end thraed
  • mannybolonemannybolone Los Angeles, CA 15,025 Posts
    mannybolone said:
    parallax said:
    It's a good track, but there are many better ones.

    I think "Unforgiven" is special. It's raw and heavy, and I agree with all you wrote about it above, Manny. I just honestly believe that the hype, rarity, and stories about acquiring (or almost acquiring) it are greater than the track itself. The crazy stuff Forty Fivan wrote about his offers to DJ OM (lurking related) for the record just works toward solidifying the record's legend. Just my opinion.

    Kindly,
    parallax

    Just to repeat Dante's point - what's the hype? I think really we had two people, Ivan and James, talmabout how great this was which got everyone curious, then Dante dropped the snippet. At that point, I was sold on the fact of, "wow, this is a really fucking great tune." The subsequent eBay auction is besides the point and in any case, I don't see it as really contributing to a "hype" factor unless you're giving the Strut echo chamber more credit than it deserves.

    Like I said - if someone thinks this tune is "average", it doesn't jibe with my opinion but I'd be curious to gauge how others think of the song relative to songs they think are way better. So, for example, I didn't find any of Rey's picks to be better, IMO. Which doesn't mean they're bad choices, I just don't happen to think they're superior to "Unforgiven."

    As for your picks, can't agree on "Melting Pot" since they're not really comparable songs but I'd agree - it's fire. The 1984 is great; I love that kind dirty, garage funk. I wouldn't put it ahead of "Unforgiven" but it'd be in the same ballpark.
    I wouldn't put "World" ahead of it, nor "Stormy Weather" but again, just a matter of taste.

    One single I would put ahead of "Unforgiven": Blackrock's "Yeah Yeah."
    Another: "Lover and a Friend" by Eddie Bo and Inez Cheatham.

    So it's not like I think it's the best thing in the world...I just can't agree that it's "pretty average." I think, as Dante says, it bangs extremely hard. But of course, that's subjective.
  • SoulhawkSoulhawk 3,197 Posts
    FortyFivan said:
    Soulhawk said:
    FortyFivan said:
    there is a distinct difference in sound between rare and common funk.

    really?

    That may be an over generalization, but I think so. I hate to apply logic considering the basis of that statement is emotional, but under produced, unpolished, emotional funk with room to experiment sounds distinctly different than well produced, polished, formulaic funk. It's the same reason I prefer college basketball over the NBA. Sloppy amateur players with hustle and heart are more entertaining to me than watching the best of the best.

    there is plenty of slickly produced funk / soul that is super rare tho - I take your point on the type of funk YOU like, but I'm not sure rarity has a SOUND
  • jamesjames chicago 1,863 Posts
    DCarfagna said:
    Just deal with the fact that the Scorpio 45 bangs extremely hard and is also dead rare.
    I think it's also worth noting that "Unforgiven" has a direct and recognizable emotional component that is absent from most 45s in its weight class.

    Beyond matters of the ear and the dick and the wallet are places that records like Arthur Monday or "Turn It Over" or Salt simply cannot take you.
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