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Does Harmony Korine get the soul strut approval?

kalakala 3,361 Posts
edited January 2008 in Strut Central
not like i really care or anythingbut I am looking foward to his next movie-Mr lonely he even cast anita pallenberg in this oneshould be interesting since he is saying it is his best work"In spite of mixed early reviews of Mister Lonely, the latest film by wunderkind Harmony Korine was not only one of the stand-out films for me at the Melbourne International Film Festival, but one of my favourites of 2007 so far. My experience of his work to date is limited to the writing of Larry Clark's Kids and his directorial debut Gummo. The former I saw relatively recently and impressed me with its gritty realism, while the latter surprised me on its theatrical release with its bleakness.Mister Lonely is a much more colourful film than anything I've associated with Korine. Its visuals (such as set design, camera angles and cinematography) are very pleasing, accentuated by its seemingly unrelated parallel narratives and absurdist premise. A Michael Jackson impersonator in France meets a Marilyn Monroe impersonator, who introduces him to a Scottish commune full of various impersonators. While superficially the film appears to be frivolous, clearly it has deeper social comments to make about identity, loneliness and alienation, issues the director has been reportedly grappling with personally.The other narrative relates to a group of missionaries in Panama, with Werner Herzog portraying a priest, Father Umbrillo, delivering food aid by plane, assisted by various nuns. While the connection between the dual narratives is unclear, this story is strangely surreal, visually alluring and entertaining.There was a small flat spot towards the end of the film, but for most of the film's 112 minutes, I had a big smile that was hard to wipe off my face. Charlie Chaplin, Shirley Temple, James Dean, Little Red Riding Hood, Queen Elizabeth, the Pope, The Three Stooges, Abraham Lincoln, Madonna and Buckwheat were all there.The humour and irony are used with a clever and skillful blend of under- and over-statement. There is an underlying subtle sadness to some of the characters who, in spite of their eccentric alter egos, remain ordinary people that an audience can relate to. The film is intelligent and emotionally honest. One part is particularly close to the bone for me and brought tears to my eyes. This is Korine's most accessible and enjoyable film. For those who value originality, I highly recommend it."

  Comments

  • BurnsBurns 2,227 Posts
    When does this drop?

    Gummo is so fuckin' cool. Most females can't stand to watch it with ya.
  • onetetonetet 1,754 Posts
    I saw this film at the Toronto Film Fest back in September and I thought it was alright. It definitely has some astounding scenes (MJ impersonator urging crowd of nursing-home residents to never die; Werner herzog coaxing nuns to jump out of a plane w/o parachutes), but it should've been 80 mins instead of 110. Maybe he trimmed it before it hits theatres; that would be a very good thing.

    Definitely more "mature" than his previous films, which means less grim and/or mean and/or transgressive material. I'm a big fan of the French actor Denis Lavant (Beau Travail, Lovers on the Bridge) and was excited to hear he was in this... however, he doesn't do nearly as much with his ample screen time as I was hoping.

    I do like Korine overall as filmmaker/artist/personality whatever, but with some reservations. The long interview with him in the new issue of ANP Quarterly is interesting.
  • kicks79kicks79 1,338 Posts
    Harmony Korine is so He justs needs to learn how to write scripts with dialogue
  • SouthCrackalackSouthCrackalack 3,853 Posts
    When does this drop?

    Gummo is so fuckin' cool. Most females can't stand to watch it with ya.

    Shit..every girl i've ever dated or kicked it with either stole my Gummo VHS oe at least borrowed it just to dub it.

    I fucks with Korine. Sure, he's a weirdo motherfucker and at times..but when I watch his movies I actually pay full attention. Which is a hell of a lot more than I can say about 96% of Hollywood releases.
  • magpaulmagpaul 1,314 Posts
  • JuniorJunior 4,853 Posts
    Pleased to see he's working with Herzog again - thought the performance he got out of him in Julien Donkey Boy was
  • bassiebassie 11,710 Posts
    Can't stand his movies - the joke is not funny, the irony is not insightful or clever, the characters are flat and I feel nothing for any of them. There are a hundred ways to do slices of life, uncomfortable truths and dark humour - but Korine has failed at it everyt time imo.

    I don't like Larry Clark's movies either - his photos I do like, but Wassup Rockers was the first thing I enjoyed by him. Him using the N word at the Toronto Film Festival screening did not endear him to me any more either.

    Good Morning.
  • onetetonetet 1,754 Posts
    Can't stand his movies - the joke is not funny, the irony is not insightful or clever, the characters are flat and I feel nothing for any of them. There are a hundred ways to do slices of life, uncomfortable truths and dark humour - but Korine has failed at it everyt time imo.

    I don't like Larry Clark's movies either - his photos I do like, but Wassup Rockers was the first thing I enjoyed by him. Him using the N word at the Toronto Film Festival screening did not endear him to me any more either.

    Good Morning.

    Definitely hate Larry Clark's films, I'm with you on that.
  • SIRUSSIRUS 2,554 Posts
    Can't stand his movies - the joke is not funny, the irony is not insightful or clever, the characters are flat and I feel nothing for any of them. There are a hundred ways to do slices of life, uncomfortable truths and dark humour - but Korine has failed at it everyt time imo.

    couldn't have put it better myself.
  • DJAckDJAck 255 Posts
    Can't stand his movies - the joke is not funny, the irony is not insightful or clever, the characters are flat and I feel nothing for any of them. There are a hundred ways to do slices of life, uncomfortable truths and dark humour - but Korine has failed at it everyt time imo.

    I don't like Larry Clark's movies either - his photos I do like, but Wassup Rockers was the first thing I enjoyed by him. Him using the N word at the Toronto Film Festival screening did not endear him to me any more either.

    Good Morning.

  • onetetonetet 1,754 Posts
    Can't stand his movies - the joke is not funny, the irony is not insightful or clever, the characters are flat and I feel nothing for any of them. There are a hundred ways to do slices of life, uncomfortable truths and dark humour - but Korine has failed at it everyt time imo.

    couldn't have put it better myself.

    I hear what you guys are saying, but: you don't find his films provocative in the least? I don't know if I think the Gummo or Julien (he doesn't consider Kids his film) really have the above goals -- i.e. I don't think he intended it to be funny and ironic or maybe even to make you feel too much for his characters.

    I think he was trying to present a damaged, destructive viewpoint that a lot of young people have as a result (consciously or otherwise) of how much the world's gotten frigged by the last few generations... I think Korine lived from that viewpoint to a certain extent, was disturbed by that self-knowledge, and was trying to exorcise it.
  • bassiebassie 11,710 Posts
    Can't stand his movies - the joke is not funny, the irony is not insightful or clever, the characters are flat and I feel nothing for any of them. There are a hundred ways to do slices of life, uncomfortable truths and dark humour - but Korine has failed at it everyt time imo.

    couldn't have put it better myself.

    I hear what you guys are saying, but: you don't find his films provocative in the least? I don't know if I think the Gummo or Julien (he doesn't consider Kids his film) really have the above goals -- i.e. I don't think he intended it to be funny and ironic or maybe even to make you feel too much for his characters.

    I think he was trying to present a damaged, destructive viewpoint that a lot of young people have as a result (consciously or otherwise) of how much the world's gotten frigged by the last few generations... I think Korine lived from that viewpoint to a certain extent, was disturbed by that self-knowledge, and was trying to exorcise it.

    He may not have had those goals, but those are the elements that make a movie good to me - Edit: not the irony part. It's not like they are so beautiful, that the story and characters can take a back seat to something that is visually or emotionally strong.

    I know you are not saying this, but frigging is not exclusive to this century, to those with social/mental/physical challenges or to poor whites with bad hair. He's not the first to use movies to exorcise personal demons/issues - and for me, he's failed in creating characters and situations that you can connect with, even if you don't like them and/or don't have experiences similar to theirs. His movies do not invite me to understand people, but to gawk at them.People aside, there is nothing makes me care about any of it.
    On paper, I have more in common with Korine than I do with someone making films in post-war Italy, but I get way more out an Antonioni movie than I do with one of Korine's.

    No, they are not provocative to me. They are too transparent and I find him insincere.
  • onetetonetet 1,754 Posts
    Can't stand his movies - the joke is not funny, the irony is not insightful or clever, the characters are flat and I feel nothing for any of them. There are a hundred ways to do slices of life, uncomfortable truths and dark humour - but Korine has failed at it everyt time imo.

    couldn't have put it better myself.

    I hear what you guys are saying, but: you don't find his films provocative in the least? I don't know if I think the Gummo or Julien (he doesn't consider Kids his film) really have the above goals -- i.e. I don't think he intended it to be funny and ironic or maybe even to make you feel too much for his characters.

    I think he was trying to present a damaged, destructive viewpoint that a lot of young people have as a result (consciously or otherwise) of how much the world's gotten frigged by the last few generations... I think Korine lived from that viewpoint to a certain extent, was disturbed by that self-knowledge, and was trying to exorcise it.

    He may not have had those goals, but those are the elements that make a movie good to me - Edit: not the irony part. It's not like they are so beautiful, that the story and characters can take a back seat to something that is visually or emotionally strong.

    I know you are not saying this, but frigging is not exclusive to this century, to those with social/mental/physical challenges or to poor whites with bad hair. He's not the first to use movies to exorcise personal demons/issues - and for me, he's failed in creating characters and situations that you can connect with, even if you don't like them and/or don't have experiences similar to theirs. His movies do not invite me to understand people, but to gawk at them.People aside, there is nothing makes me care about any of it.
    On paper, I have more in common with Korine than I do with someone making films in post-war Italy, but I get way more out an Antonioni movie than I do with one of Korine's.

    No, they are not provocative to me. They are too transparent and I find him insincere.

    One thing I found interesting about him is a series of comments he made about hating John Waters' films for a)insincerity and b)basically doing what you feel Korine does -- holding his characters up to be gawked at. He got really livid on the subject. I thought that was a provocative line to draw in the sand.. if he's to believed (and sure, there's reason to question his sincerity), he really feels like he's putting himself and his friends out there. And I will say I have known and do know people who remind me very much of the characters in Gummo.

    But shit, if you're putting him up against Antonioni -- gotta go with Antonioni, of course. Still, I did find it interesting that many major directors I respect are eager to collaborate with him: not just Herzog, but also Claire Denis (she called him "a genius" at a TIFF Q+A -- although their collabo never got made). It suggests to me that some of the problems people have with his work is tied up in cultural baggage that may get filtered out by European (for instance) eyes.
  • bassiebassie 11,710 Posts
    Can't stand his movies - the joke is not funny, the irony is not insightful or clever, the characters are flat and I feel nothing for any of them. There are a hundred ways to do slices of life, uncomfortable truths and dark humour - but Korine has failed at it everyt time imo.

    couldn't have put it better myself.

    I hear what you guys are saying, but: you don't find his films provocative in the least? I don't know if I think the Gummo or Julien (he doesn't consider Kids his film) really have the above goals -- i.e. I don't think he intended it to be funny and ironic or maybe even to make you feel too much for his characters.

    I think he was trying to present a damaged, destructive viewpoint that a lot of young people have as a result (consciously or otherwise) of how much the world's gotten frigged by the last few generations... I think Korine lived from that viewpoint to a certain extent, was disturbed by that self-knowledge, and was trying to exorcise it.

    He may not have had those goals, but those are the elements that make a movie good to me - Edit: not the irony part. It's not like they are so beautiful, that the story and characters can take a back seat to something that is visually or emotionally strong.

    I know you are not saying this, but frigging is not exclusive to this century, to those with social/mental/physical challenges or to poor whites with bad hair. He's not the first to use movies to exorcise personal demons/issues - and for me, he's failed in creating characters and situations that you can connect with, even if you don't like them and/or don't have experiences similar to theirs. His movies do not invite me to understand people, but to gawk at them.People aside, there is nothing makes me care about any of it.
    On paper, I have more in common with Korine than I do with someone making films in post-war Italy, but I get way more out an Antonioni movie than I do with one of Korine's.

    No, they are not provocative to me. They are too transparent and I find him insincere.

    One thing I found interesting about him is a series of comments he made about hating John Waters' films for a)insincerity and b)basically doing what you feel Korine does -- holding his characters up to be gawked at. He got really livid on the subject. I thought that was a provocative line to draw in the sand.. if he's to believed (and sure, there's reason to question his sincerity), he really feels like he's putting himself and his friends out there. And I will say I have known and do know people who remind me very much of the characters in Gummo.

    But shit, if you're putting him up against Antonioni -- gotta go with Antonioni, of course. Still, I did find it interesting that many major directors I respect are eager to collaborate with him: not just Herzog, but also Claire Denis (she called him "a genius" at a TIFF Q+A -- although their collabo never got made). It suggests to me that some of the problems people have with his work is tied up in cultural baggage that may get filtered out by European (for instance) eyes. [/b]

    Yea, I would definitely agree with that, but good films should transcend that culutral baggage.
    As far as Denis goes, I can totally see her attraction to his filmmaking and I would say that it may not only be the cultural difference, but the age, too.

    LOL - Korine hates Waters' films for those reasons? Hilarious. I think Waters is actually great at making movies about 'oddballs' and showing them as living breathing feeling people...who in the hands of a colder, more immature filmmaker would seem like nothing more than two-dimensional freaks.

    Yea, I should revise what I said - Korine probably makes him movies in the way that he does with sincerity, but they just don't feel so to me.
  • onetetonetet 1,754 Posts


    Yea, I would definitely agree with that, but good films should transcend that culutral baggage.
    As far as Denis goes, I can totally see her attraction to his filmmaking and I would say that it may not only be the cultural difference, but the age, too.

    LOL - Korine hates Waters' films for those reasons? Hilarious. I think Waters is actually great at making movies about 'oddballs' and showing them as living breathing feeling people...who in the hands of a colder, more immature filmmaker would seem like nothing more than two-dimensional freaks.

    Yea, I should revise what I said - Korine probably makes him movies in the way that he does with sincerity, but they just don't feel so to me.

    Cool. You may want to give Mister Lonely a look. Unless he's cut it substantially, it isn't "better" than his earlier work -- but there's no question that it's different, and that a lot of the qualities you disliked in his earlier work are diminished or absent.

    Also, check out the ANP Quarterly inteview with him if you get a chance and can find a copy. To me, it came across as nothing if not sincere, and addresses a lot of your complaints (without getting defensive).

    Waters is a whole other thing... he brings out a lotta hometown pride in me, but at the same time I don't think he's made a decent film since Serial Mom ('93, I think?). Also, he is a genuinely kind person, but I do think that there's something of a "gawker" in him. I don't think befriending someone and using them to be gawked at on film are necessarily mutually exclusive.
  • rape_donkeysrape_donkeys 615 Posts
    in terms of artists working with themes of abjection and a kind of psychology of isolation, the guy is definitely doing something unique and successful. you know when you step into one of his films that you're setting yourself up for something that will be challenging. i don't think his films are meant to be 'enjoyed.' it's actually incredible to me that his films even see theatrical release. and where someone like antonioni utilizes psychological discomfort and duration as a trope amidst many other things going on (romance, landscape, intrigue), korine is just relentless with it. it's a lot to take, but i have always found his work to be worth it. you just can't expect his films to do things that other films do.

    and you can add me to the larry clark is a bullshit artist faction.
  • GenePontecorvoGenePontecorvo 5,612 Posts


    and you can add me to the larry clark is a bullshit artist faction.

    He accidentally made a good movie in "Bully". Shit makes me skeevy though.
  • marwal_bustmarwal_bust 195 Posts
    This post is making me feel like " want to start a "Does Todd Solondz get the soul strut approva" thread...yet that may just become a redundant in comment/response...although I do like both, I do feel like Solondz and Waters do it a little smarter where it isn't so heavily relying on "relentless psychological discomfort"...
  • onetetonetet 1,754 Posts
    This post is making me feel like " want to start a "Does Todd Solondz get the soul strut approva" thread...yet that may just become a redundant in comment/response...although I do like both, I do feel like Solondz and Waters do it a little smarter where it isn't so heavily relying on "relentless psychological discomfort"...

    I "enjoy" Solondz's films far more than I do Korine's, but I think Korine is a more adventurous/exploratory filmmaker, and also more film-literate, if that makes any sense. That said, if you told me that both had new films opening tonight, it'd be the Solondz I'd be most excited about -- by far.

    I love Solondz's humor, and his characters tend to relate to the problems of the world with deep depressions more than wild acting out. Much as I wish it were otherwise, deep depression's prolly more my style.
  • bassiebassie 11,710 Posts
    Now I'm beginning to wonder "is it me?" I am not talking about not liking the discomfort - some of my favourite films make me very uncomfortable and are full of people I do not like - but Korine's films do not make me feel anything, I am left cold in every way. This the main reason for my dislike.
  • pabloscooterpabloscooter 370 Posts
    Harmony > Waters

    And if I relate to his characters does that mean I'm fake and shallow?
  • marwal_bustmarwal_bust 195 Posts
    Harmony > Waters

    Get on Waters Level


    Anyone who creates a baby MJ crawling to a baby Manson doll = A STEP ABOVE
  • onetetonetet 1,754 Posts
    Now I'm beginning to wonder "is it me?" I am not talking about not liking the discomfort - some of my favourite films make me very uncomfortable and are full of people I do not like - but Korine's films do not make me feel anything, I am left cold in every way. This the main reason for my dislike.

    Just curious -- have you seen any of Bruno Dumont's films, and if so, how'd you feel about them?
  • bassiebassie 11,710 Posts
    No...(I am blushing) I think you suggested 29 Palms to me before, right?

    I just read some synopses and it looks like I better get on that!
  • onetetonetet 1,754 Posts
    Yeah, Twenty Nine Palms is probably his most controversial film. He also did Life of Jesus (not about the historical/religious figure named Jesus), Humanite (his most acclaimed -- I think it won the Palme D'or), and most recently Flandres (that last one relatively weak).

    His films produce a "cold" feeling in me, but at the same time definitely have an impact. Maybe I would say they're "shattering" in the way that Irreversible (for instance) was supposed to be.

    Twenty Nine Palms is a much hated film, played TIFF alongside Brown Bunny and had similar / / reactions.

    BTW, make sure you get this one:


    and NOT this one:


    released around the same time.

    altho from some of what you're saying (plus how much my recommendation of Zulawski's "Possession" flopped w/ you), I'm guessing you might not dig it.
  • MoSSMoSS 458 Posts
    Yeah, Twenty Nine Palms is probably his most controversial film. He also did Life of Jesus (not about the historical/religious figure named Jesus), Humanite (his most acclaimed -- I think it won the Palme D'or), and most recently Flandres (that last one relatively weak).

    I liked Twenty Nine Palms although most of the people I know didn't. I had no idea the same guy directed Flandres, I didn't really pay attention to detail. I think Flandres could have made my worst of 2007 list. Have you seen it yet? A lot of people told me to check it out, but I still can't figure out why.
  • onetetonetet 1,754 Posts
    Yeah, Twenty Nine Palms is probably his most controversial film. He also did Life of Jesus (not about the historical/religious figure named Jesus), Humanite (his most acclaimed -- I think it won the Palme D'or), and most recently Flandres (that last one relatively weak).

    I liked Twenty Nine Palms although most of the people I know didn't. I had no idea the same guy directed Flandres, I didn't really pay attention to detail. I think Flandres could have made my worst of 2007 list. Have you seen it yet? A lot of people told me to check it out, but I still can't figure out why.

    I saw Flanders at the 06 Toronto fest. Definitely disappointing. Obviously he wanted to speak to the Iraq War but he didn't show me anything I didn't already know. For the first time, the pain he drags his characters through felt false, forced, contrived, etc.
  • kalakala 3,361 Posts
    in terms of artists working with themes of abjection and a kind of psychology of isolation, the guy is definitely doing something unique and successful. you know when you step into one of his films that you're setting yourself up for something that will be challenging. i don't think his films are meant to be 'enjoyed.' it's actually incredible to me that his films even see theatrical release. and where someone like antonioni utilizes psychological discomfort and duration as a trope amidst many other things going on (romance, landscape, intrigue), korine is just relentless with it. it's a lot to take, but i have always found his work to be worth it. you just can't expect his films to do things that other films do.

    and you can add me to the larry clark is a bullshit artist faction.


    welcome back
    sick mix
    malaria?
  • DongerDonger 854 Posts
    in terms of artists working with themes of abjection and a kind of psychology of isolation, the guy is definitely doing something unique and successful. you know when you step into one of his films that you're setting yourself up for something that will be challenging. i don't think his films are meant to be 'enjoyed.' it's actually incredible to me that his films even see theatrical release. and where someone like antonioni utilizes psychological discomfort and duration as a trope amidst many other things going on (romance, landscape, intrigue), korine is just relentless with it. it's a lot to take, but i have always found his work to be worth it. you just can't expect his films to do things that other films do.

    I liked Gummo, although I wasn't feeling Chloe's scenes. The film would have been better off without them.

    I couldn't get into Julien Donkey Boy. I forced myself to finish watching it, hoping for some kind of payoff, but there was none

    I'm still down to check out his new one though, because no matter what, I know it won't be like anything else i've ever seen.

    Did you read his book, "A crack up at the race riots"?
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