If your selections get the crowd open, they're less likely to notice if your technique isn't super flashy.
aka. gilles peterson's mantra
i think gilles would be the first to admit that he lacks "dj skillz." the fact that he travels around the world constantly and consistently tears shit up on the dancefloor is a testament to selection over skills.
part of it, and everyone's sorta hinted at it, is that it's sorta genre-specific. if it's house or techno, then you HAVE to beatmatch, otherwise you're to the curb.
hip-hop, you can sort of fake it, and just slam in a lot and all that. beatmatching is better, of course, but you can sort of get around it.
raer 45 and other non-electronic stuff does not need to be mixed. i know certain cats like to mix and cut 45's, but i almost prefer it not be. i like hearing songs like that all the way through. i'm definitely not mad at someone like Keb Darge who just plays one record, then another.
If you're talking hiphop then selection backed with some basic skills. The music was made for mixing and layering over other tracks, so if you're gonna DJ it, then I would at least a basic ability to mix. The problem I have with hiphop DJ's are those that don't know when to shut up on the cut and let the music breathe.
As far as funk, soul, vintage r&b - ya know, the music that was made for people to dance to.....selection selection selection. I don't want to hear a track beat matched, scratched over or fucked around with. Gimme the track as the band intended and then through the power of your selection, blend it into the next record.
Knowledge is key - know your records, and how to build a set. If I wanna see some skills, I'd rather see it at a DMC competition than contend with the huddlers hawking over the decks in a club.
If you're talking hiphop then selection backed with some basic skills. The music was made for mixing and layering over other tracks, so if you're gonna DJ it, then I would at least a basic ability to mix. The problem I have with hiphop DJ's are those that don't know when to shut up on the cut and let the music breathe.
what do you mean shut up on the cut? like scratching too much or not letting the song play for long enough?
David Mancuso became a legend for his club the Loft in the 70's despite never mixing a record. The way the audiophile decks and amp was set up didn't allow it. He plays each track in its entirity
Skills though are expected by most partygoers but selection will always be the most important thing. You can learn to mix and gain DJ skills but the art of selection is a much harder thing to acquire
David Mancuso became a legend for his club the Loft in the 70's despite never mixing a record. The way the audiophile decks and amp was set up didn't allow it. He plays each track in its entirity
i always thought that was his steez, i seem to remember reading an article where he was extolling the virtues of playing the entire song.. but you're saying it was becuase of the equipment he was working w/? just curious, tryin to get my mind right on this one..
David Mancuso became a legend for his club the Loft in the 70's despite never mixing a record. The way the audiophile decks and amp was set up didn't allow it. He plays each track in its entirity
i always thought that was his steez, i seem to remember reading an article where he was extolling the virtues of playing the entire song.. but you're saying it was becuase of the equipment he was working w/? just curious, tryin to get my mind right on this one..
If memory serves me, it was the fact that mixing wasn't a priority that he had the set up the way he did, but I also think that was in the beginning.
Me, if I had to pass a test in front of a panel of other DJs, I would probably flunk the 'skillz' test and ace the selection. Put me front of the average Saturday crowd and grumpy bartenders, I pass all the way around. My partner is pretty much of the same mindset, although he is much more concerned with matching precisely. I enjoy the challenge of transforming a hip hop club into a gay disco in 3 songs, and seeing how long I can sustain a certain vibe, and then take another corner, all while keeping whatever people in that specific crowd along with me.
However, I would argue that selection is more important in general, because shitty selection cannot be covered by technical skills, while it usually works the other way round.
you should see me rockin' doubles of "owner of a lonely heart". Cosine on J-Rocc, he is that dude.
David Mancuso became a legend for his club the Loft in the 70's despite never mixing a record. The way the audiophile decks and amp was set up didn't allow it. He plays each track in its entirity
i always thought that was his steez, i seem to remember reading an article where he was extolling
I play with people who are learning to dj now, the usually take the early shift since the aren't technical yet, but they play good music, and often start the dancefloor in a good way. People have to learn to dj one way or the other, and I got on the same way as they are now - by warming up for more technically accomplished djs. But if they didn't have good taste in music, I wouldn't bother. And yes, we split the money even steven. I think it should be clear that someone's doing less work if they should get less money, not just lesser quality work. There's a learning curve for everyone.
if he's skilless, he shouldn't have been included in the first fucking place.
RU serious. Lighten up
I'm just poiting out it's really not a hand-wringing decision. if you don't like how your boy does his thing - don't make him in involved and then there's not need for this thread. bottom line - if he gets on the decks, he gets dough like everyone else - PERIOD.
I'm too lazy to BPM my shit. I have too many records. So that pretty much says it all for me. I pull my records a few hours before the gig.
I was just thinking about getting rid of most of my hip hop 12s. That is the genre where I feel embarrassed playing out when my beat batching chops are not up to par. Plus, there's rarely a shortage of good hip hop DJs in any town.
I'll bother to mix some disco, but everything else I'm interested in playing does not require precise beat matching. I use certain parts of the song as transition points and I think that's effective.
If you're talking hiphop then selection backed with some basic skills. The music was made for mixing and layering over other tracks, so if you're gonna DJ it, then I would at least a basic ability to mix. The problem I have with hiphop DJ's are those that don't know when to shut up on the cut and let the music breathe.
As far as funk, soul, vintage r&b - ya know, the music that was made for people to dance to.....selection selection selection. I don't want to hear a track beat matched, scratched over or fucked around with. Gimme the track as the band intended and then through the power of your selection, blend it into the next record.
Knowledge is key - know your records, and how to build a set. If I wanna see some skills, I'd rather see it at a DMC competition than contend with the huddlers hawking over the decks in a club.
Another thing to remember is that 45s are often fragile, and not just the styrenes. So someone who might be good or decent at mixing hip hop 12's and LPS with smooth beatmatching or drops, nice scratch cues and the like, might not play exactly the same way with different media ie: old funk 45s that you really don't want to destroy quickly. So unless the dude is rocking Microwave, I'd keep that in mind.
David Mancuso became a legend for his club the Loft in the 70's despite never mixing a record. The way the audiophile decks and amp was set up didn't allow it. He plays each track in its entirity
i always thought that was his steez, i seem to remember reading an article where he was extolling the virtues of playing the entire song.. but you're saying it was becuase of the equipment he was working w/? just curious, tryin to get my mind right on this one..
from what I've read, Mancuso is a huge audiophile, and was more concerned with the sound quality and the overall atmosphere of the party (i.e. - having fans and strobelites to simulate a storm while playing a recording of a thunderstorm as a transition). I mean, dude spent like $10,000 for a single cartridge/needle made by a samurai sword maker in Japan.
A DJ gets paid to move the house. Whether they match or scratch is irrelevant. Proof is in the pudding. If people are moving, you are doing your job. I had a very successful gig at a club for 5 years, packed every Friday night and I couldn't beat match to save my life. Selection and timing is everything.
David Mancuso became a legend for his club the Loft in the 70's despite never mixing a record. The way the audiophile decks and amp was set up didn't allow it. He plays each track in its entirity
i always thought that was his steez, i seem to remember reading an article where he was extolling the virtues of playing the entire song.. but you're saying it was becuase of the equipment he was working w/? just curious, tryin to get my mind right on this one..
HMmm I understood that Mancuso played the whole song because he was weird about that (IE he played one song even if it faded out slowly and then put on another song.. not even crossfading as one song was ending in to the next), not because the equipment didn't allow it.. mixers were readily available at that time.
A DJ gets paid to move the house. Whether they match or scratch is irrelevant. Proof is in the pudding. If people are moving, you are doing your job. I had a very successful gig at a club for 5 years, packed every Friday night and I couldn't beat match to save my life. Selection and timing is everything.
this is kind of a silly debate. will people stop dancing to a set of club bangers because they are not mixed? no.
however, what you are saying basically goes against the whole concept that a dj is > than an ipod. selection and timing are just aspects of djing. if you dont think that a technically skilled dj can move the crowd a whole lot better, than you havent seen too many good djs. why didnt you bother learning how to mix if you had a club gig for 5 years? where was this club by the way?
its all about programming and being able to read a crowd. Ill use SKILLLZZZZ when they are needed, but Im not to fancy with that shit. I do alot of turntable slow down mixes to break up genres, and beat match with hip hop and downtempo (which in my opinion is somewhat easy to get the hang of if you bpm your shit and know how the record goes) I also scratch with the hip hop too.
But for funk jams and shit that was played with live drummers i do the ol blend when its fading out and bring in the next track so its somewhat seemless. I find it hard to mix rare groove stuff with live drums cause it always drifts.
But at the end of the day you have to know your records and what your packing in your crates. It doesnt matter if you can do crazy crabs and flares if you cant keep a crowd happy with your song choices. Also you have to have that six sense of being able to read a crowd and foretell where you should be taking them.
Hell, we just excluded one dude from our big soul night because he did have crazy good skills. Its not because we are jealous, its just we do 45s, one right after another. He would clear the dancefloor with his juggling, scratching and blending and his boy doing shout outs and shit during the music....fucked up the vibe big time. But we would never cut him short on the money when he did it, thats stupid..he played, he got paid. We simply just didnt invite him back...whoever is running the night can make that decision...but if a dude plays, you pay him, regardless of how good/not good you think he is...if you dont want to pay him, dont have him play, simple.
Comments
delicious!
i think gilles would be the first to admit that he lacks "dj skillz." the fact that he travels around the world constantly and consistently tears shit up on the dancefloor is a testament to selection over skills.
part of it, and everyone's sorta hinted at it, is that it's sorta genre-specific. if it's house or techno, then you HAVE to beatmatch, otherwise you're to the curb.
hip-hop, you can sort of fake it, and just slam in a lot and all that. beatmatching is better, of course, but you can sort of get around it.
raer 45 and other non-electronic stuff does not need to be mixed. i know certain cats like to mix and cut 45's, but i almost prefer it not be. i like hearing songs like that all the way through. i'm definitely not mad at someone like Keb Darge who just plays one record, then another.
As far as funk, soul, vintage r&b - ya know, the music that was made for people to dance to.....selection selection selection. I don't want to hear a track beat matched, scratched over or fucked around with. Gimme the track as the band intended and then through the power of your selection, blend it into the next record.
Knowledge is key - know your records, and how to build a set. If I wanna see some skills, I'd rather see it at a DMC competition than contend with the huddlers hawking over the decks in a club.
what do you mean shut up on the cut? like scratching too much or not letting the song play for long enough?
hatin it. plus it seems like the heavy scratchers don't know thing one about maintaining proper levels on the scratch channel..
Skills though are expected by most partygoers but selection will always be the most important thing. You can learn to mix and gain DJ skills but the art of selection is a much harder thing to acquire
i always thought that was his steez, i seem to remember reading an article where he was extolling the virtues of playing the entire song.. but you're saying it was becuase of the equipment he was working w/? just curious, tryin to get my mind right on this one..
If memory serves me, it was the fact that mixing wasn't a priority that he had the set up the way he did, but I also think that was in the beginning.
Me, if I had to pass a test in front of a panel of other DJs, I would probably flunk the 'skillz' test and ace the selection. Put me front of the average Saturday crowd and grumpy bartenders, I pass all the way around. My partner is pretty much of the same mindset, although he is much more concerned with matching precisely. I enjoy the challenge of transforming a hip hop club into a gay disco in 3 songs, and seeing how long I can sustain a certain vibe, and then take another corner, all while keeping whatever people in that specific crowd along with me.
you should see me rockin' doubles of "owner of a lonely heart". Cosine on J-Rocc, he is that dude.
RU serious. Lighten up
I'm just poiting out it's really not a hand-wringing decision. if you don't like how your boy does his thing - don't make him in involved and then there's not need for this thread. bottom line - if he gets on the decks, he gets dough like everyone else - PERIOD.
I was just thinking about getting rid of most of my hip hop 12s. That is the genre where I feel embarrassed playing out when my beat batching chops are not up to par. Plus, there's rarely a shortage of good hip hop DJs in any town.
I'll bother to mix some disco, but everything else I'm interested in playing does not require precise beat matching. I use certain parts of the song as transition points and I think that's effective.
too much scratching is not good, especially at imnappropriate times.
trainwrecking is not advised.
good selections are advised, and i do like the gilles peterson mantra.
however, there are doods around me that have no business behind two turntables, let alone even attempting to beatmatch or scratch.
Another thing to remember is that 45s are often fragile, and not just the styrenes. So someone who might be good or decent at mixing hip hop 12's and LPS with smooth beatmatching or drops, nice scratch cues and the like, might not play exactly the same way with different media ie: old funk 45s that you really don't want to destroy quickly. So unless the dude is rocking Microwave, I'd keep that in mind.
from what I've read, Mancuso is a huge audiophile, and was more concerned with the sound quality and the overall atmosphere of the party (i.e. - having fans and strobelites to simulate a storm while playing a recording of a thunderstorm as a transition). I mean, dude spent like $10,000 for a single cartridge/needle made by a samurai sword maker in Japan.
"You hawked a Hattori Hanzo sword?"
I'll be over at 5:00!
add crowd reading and improving on skills
That changes everything.. HE'S OUT OF THE GROUP!!
HMmm I understood that Mancuso played the whole song because he was weird about that (IE he played one song even if it faded out slowly and then put on another song.. not even crossfading as one song was ending in to the next), not because the equipment didn't allow it.. mixers were readily available at that time.
this is kind of a silly debate. will people stop dancing to a set of club bangers because they are not mixed? no.
however, what you are saying basically goes against the whole concept that a dj is > than an ipod. selection and timing are just aspects of djing. if you dont think that a technically skilled dj can move the crowd a whole lot better, than you havent seen too many good djs. why didnt you bother learning how to mix if you had a club gig for 5 years? where was this club by the way?
But for funk jams and shit that was played with live drummers i do the ol blend when its fading out and bring in the next track so its somewhat seemless. I find it hard to mix rare groove stuff with live drums cause it always drifts.
But at the end of the day you have to know your records and what your packing in your crates. It doesnt matter if you can do crazy crabs and flares if you cant keep a crowd happy with your song choices. Also you have to have that six sense of being able to read a crowd and foretell where you should be taking them.