And if I just show you ONE game, in the playoffs where Shaq took over and scored 18 points in the 4th quarter you'll retract your assertion he doesn't deliver in the clutch...???
I hate to do this to such a nice guy but please watch this video and remark who is shooting when the Lakers take the lead. Not shown in the video are Shaq's two massive facials that he laid down in the 4th quarter.
Again this post was not intended to take anything away from Shaq's legacy or importance with the Lakers. Just saying he made a big claim with that statement, and that he would have a lot more fans if he didn't make stupid comments like that from time to time. Shaq, just shut up and play. And let Dwade win you one more ring.
At which point he'll make comments like:
"Dwade is the best player in the league right now. I'm happy lil brother could help out Big Daddy win another one."
I hate to do this to such a nice guy but please watch this video and remark who is shooting when the Lakers take the lead. Not shown in the video are Shaq's two massive facials that he laid down in the 4th quarter.
LMAO !!!!
PUHLEEZE ......i know that game very well ....Shaq did more in that game to help create the 15 point deficit than he did during the comeback ...the "highlight" was Kobe's alley oop to Shaq, but believe me when i tell you Shaq was not responsible for that win .....Shaq did hit two big free throws in that game ..BUT.....he took just nine shots and made ONLY five IN AN ELIMINATION GAME ...and his play in that entire series caused us to almost choke a 3-1 series lead
Brian Shaw made three crucial 3-pointers for the Lakers, one at the end of the third quarter and two during the big fourth-quarter rally.[i]
[i]Bryant,had 25 points, 11 rebounds, seven assists and four blocked shots. he sank two from the line to put the Lakers ahead for good, 81-79, with 1:34 remaining.
First you say Shaq sucks in the Playoffs.....and with a 25.6 pt./12.2 rbs. lifetime playoff average that is proved to be wrong.
Then you say ....Well, these two guys(Wallace & Duncan) outplay him in the playoffs and that is proven to be wrong...
NOW..you're saying well he chokes in the 4th Quarter of playoff games.
There is no question he's past his prime, yet this past year in the playoffs he scored 25 when DWade was sick and only managed 14 points.
AND in the final game against Detroit he shot 12-14 from the field, scored 28 points, had 16 rebounds, and didn't miss a shot in the 4th quarter.
While Big Ben scored 7 points....had 7 rebounds and lost the elimination game by 17.
As you know, it's pretty hard to find quarter by quarter stats or else I'd be laying them out here by the truckload.
If you know a site that has stats broken down by each quarter tell us where it is so you can at least have ONE stat to back up your argument.
Shaq has one weakness in his game.....Free Throw shooting, and some teams, namely Dallas have tried to take advantage of that via "Hack-A-Shaq" which did cause the Lakers to sit him on the bench in close games......no doubt.
If Shaq could shoot 80% from the line there would be some discussion of him being the greatest player of all time.....but since he can't he'll have to settle for being one of the five best centers in history of the game and the best over the last 20 years.
If you can still find some negatives buried in that greatness you are indeed the hatter you claim not to be.
Give the man his props and stop hyping sub-Dennis Rodman talent like Ben Wallace.
First you say Shaq sucks in the Playoffs.....and with a 25.6 pt./12.2 rbs. lifetime playoff average that is proved to be wrong.
didn't say he sucked ....i said he disappears in the clutch
Then you say ....Well, these two guys(Wallace & Duncan) outplay him in the playoffs
Wallace did outplay him in the Lakers vs Pistons finals ....Duncan has carried the Spurs for years ...put Duncan on the Lakers and they still win those 3 rings
NOW..you're saying well he chokes in the 4th Quarter of playoff games.
choke may be too strong of a word.....i'd say he's not a major factor late in important games
There is no question he's past his prime, yet this past year in the playoffs he scored 25 when DWade was sick and only managed 14 points.
against ?
Shaq has one weakness in his game.....
his inability to defend the high pick & roll is a much bigger problem than his free throw shooting
Give the man his props and stop hyping sub-Dennis Rodman talent like Ben Wallace.
Ben Wallace is a better rebounder,defender and shot blocker....of course i would take Shaq over Ben but his defense is just as important as Shaq's points ...The Heat played better most times when Alonzo was in the game ...which is why Riley sat Shaq's ass down so many times ...
...put Duncan on the Lakers and they still win those 3 rings
I agree with this....but isn't that like saying "put Wilt on those Celtics teams instead of Russell and they would have won too".....because they would have, but that doesn't diminish Russell as a player.
And Duncan is the only current player you could replace Shaq with.
Here's how I would rate the 15 Best centers of All-Time......how different would yours be??
1) Kareem 2) Wilt 3) Bill Russell 4) Moses Malone 5) Shaq 6) Hakeem 7) Tim Duncan 8) Nate Thurmond 9) Bill Walton 10) Willis Reed 11) Patrick Ewing 12) Robert Parish 13) David Robinson 14) Wes Unseld 15) Bill Lambier
Shaq has one weakness in his game.....Free Throw shooting, and some teams, namely Dallas have tried to take advantage of that via "Hack-A-Shaq" which did cause the Lakers to sit him on the bench in close games......no doubt.
That's why he's not as effective in the 4th. And that's when clutch guards have stepped up as Ed was saying.
Also, I think we've all seen many times how he was immobile on the high pick and roll, and how numerous PF's hit the 15ft. jumper in his face, even during his prime years.
Shaq clogs the middle, not like Duncan who can hit the 15ft bank or Wallace who is the most mobile of the three. The triangle offense was predictable, and if it weren't for Shaq getting double-teamed, and Fisher, Fox, and Horry consistently hitting their J's, then those championships woulda never been won.
But aside from those weaknesses, I would easily rank him in the top 5 centers of all time.
and if it weren't for Shaq getting double-teamed, and Fisher, Fox, and Horry consistently hitting their J's, then those championships woulda never been won.
and if it weren't for Shaq getting double-teamed, and Fisher, Fox, and Horry consistently hitting their J's, then those championships woulda never been won.
Hello. That's what Shaq provides. Basketball 101.
I'm saying that those three players hit their jumpshots with consistency. Shaq is 1/3rd of the Championship Lakers.
there are factors being left out of this discussion. so far, the talk has been about stats and performance. what about leadership? with the Lakers, Shaq would lift the team on his shoulders when he was in a good mood. but, if he felt slighted or down for any reason, his negativity might poison the squad. Shaq desperately wants to be perceived as a man (or Superman), but a lot of times he was a prima donna on the Lakers and behaved like a girl. that weakened the team. he wouldn't show up for practice if he didn't feel like it or would take a long time off for a minor injury. after 2000, he seemed to look at the regular season and plan to miss at least 18 games each year.
also, doesn't size enter the picture when discussing the effectiveness of centers? was it ever possible for a smaller guy who played with more gusto to out-play a healthy Shaq in his prime?....(we're not talking about the tall centers who are spazzes.)
Comments
i'm still waiting ....
hard to find one game ?
The Lakers won several important playoff games with Shaq on the bench in the 4th quarter .......Shaq has no dominant moment to diminish
At which point he'll make comments like:
"Dwade is the best player in the league right now. I'm happy lil brother could help out Big Daddy win another one."
LMAO !!!!
PUHLEEZE ......i know that game very well ....Shaq did more in that game to help create the 15 point deficit than he did during the comeback ...the "highlight" was Kobe's alley oop to Shaq, but believe me when i tell you Shaq was not responsible for that win .....Shaq did hit two big free throws in that game ..BUT.....he took just nine shots and made ONLY five IN AN ELIMINATION GAME ...and his play in that entire series caused us to almost choke a 3-1 series lead
Brian Shaw made three crucial 3-pointers for the Lakers, one at the end of the third quarter and two during the big fourth-quarter rally.[i]
[i]Bryant,had 25 points, 11 rebounds, seven assists and four blocked shots. he sank two from the line to put the Lakers ahead for good, 81-79, with 1:34 remaining.
First you say Shaq sucks in the Playoffs.....and with a 25.6 pt./12.2 rbs. lifetime playoff average that is proved to be wrong.
Then you say ....Well, these two guys(Wallace & Duncan) outplay him in the playoffs and that is proven to be wrong...
NOW..you're saying well he chokes in the 4th Quarter of playoff games.
There is no question he's past his prime, yet this past year in the playoffs he scored 25 when DWade was sick and only managed 14 points.
AND in the final game against Detroit he shot 12-14 from the field, scored 28 points, had 16 rebounds, and didn't miss a shot in the 4th quarter.
While Big Ben scored 7 points....had 7 rebounds and lost the elimination game by 17.
As you know, it's pretty hard to find quarter by quarter stats or else I'd be laying them out here by the truckload.
If you know a site that has stats broken down by each quarter tell us where it is so you can at least have ONE stat to back up your argument.
Shaq has one weakness in his game.....Free Throw shooting, and some teams, namely Dallas have tried to take advantage of that via "Hack-A-Shaq" which did cause the Lakers to sit him on the bench in close games......no doubt.
If Shaq could shoot 80% from the line there would be some discussion of him being the greatest player of all time.....but since he can't he'll have to settle for being one of the five best centers in history of the game and the best over the last 20 years.
If you can still find some negatives buried in that greatness you are indeed the hatter you claim not to be.
Give the man his props and stop hyping sub-Dennis Rodman talent like Ben Wallace.
didn't say he sucked ....i said he disappears in the clutch
Wallace did outplay him in the Lakers vs Pistons finals ....Duncan has carried the Spurs for years ...put Duncan on the Lakers and they still win those 3 rings
choke may be too strong of a word.....i'd say he's not a major factor late in important games
against ?
his inability to defend the high pick & roll is a much bigger problem than his free throw shooting
Ben Wallace is a better rebounder,defender and shot blocker....of course i would take Shaq over Ben but his defense is just as important as Shaq's points ...The Heat played better most times when Alonzo was in the game ...which is why Riley sat Shaq's ass down so many times ...
you are not alone. Your boy, Rasheed Wallace, said the same thing recently on Quite Frankly.
I agree with this....but isn't that like saying "put Wilt on those Celtics teams instead of Russell and they would have won too".....because they would have, but that doesn't diminish Russell as a player.
And Duncan is the only current player you could replace Shaq with.
Here's how I would rate the 15 Best centers of All-Time......how different would yours be??
1) Kareem
2) Wilt
3) Bill Russell
4) Moses Malone
5) Shaq
6) Hakeem
7) Tim Duncan
8) Nate Thurmond
9) Bill Walton
10) Willis Reed
11) Patrick Ewing
12) Robert Parish
13) David Robinson
14) Wes Unseld
15) Bill Lambier
This is exactly how it's going to go down. Except he won't be able to restrain himself from saying something about "the other guy".
That's why he's not as effective in the 4th. And that's when clutch guards have stepped up as Ed was saying.
Also, I think we've all seen many times how he was immobile on the high pick and roll, and how numerous PF's hit the 15ft. jumper in his face, even during his prime years.
Shaq clogs the middle, not like Duncan who can hit the 15ft bank or Wallace who is the most mobile of the three. The triangle offense was predictable, and if it weren't for Shaq getting double-teamed, and Fisher, Fox, and Horry consistently hitting their J's, then those championships woulda never been won.
But aside from those weaknesses, I would easily rank him in the top 5 centers of all time.
SHAQ RULES!
LAKERS 4EVER!
Hello. That's what Shaq provides. Basketball 101.
whereas, an almost veteran kobe along with lamar odom & caron butler failed to make it the following year?
i know this comparison is iffy but shit, give me d-wade over kobe anyday.
I'm saying that those three players hit their jumpshots with consistency.
Shaq is 1/3rd of the Championship Lakers.
there are factors being left out of this discussion. so far, the talk has been about stats and performance. what about leadership? with the Lakers, Shaq would lift the team on his shoulders when he was in a good mood. but, if he felt slighted or down for any reason, his negativity might poison the squad. Shaq desperately wants to be perceived as a man (or Superman), but a lot of times he was a prima donna on the Lakers and behaved like a girl. that weakened the team. he wouldn't show up for practice if he didn't feel like it or would take a long time off for a minor injury. after 2000, he seemed to look at the regular season and plan to miss at least 18 games each year.
also, doesn't size enter the picture when discussing the effectiveness of centers? was it ever possible for a smaller guy who played with more gusto to out-play a healthy Shaq in his prime?....(we're not talking about the tall centers who are spazzes.)