ginger baker-the daddy of all rock drummers?

kala

who could compete in 1966?
watts?
ringo?
ummmm i don't think so

RAJ

Yes. While he was technical and innovative. His over-use of the toms never did it for me.

I preferred the tri-fecta known as Bonham, Mitchell, Moon

BTW: that video is redic

asstro

Great videos but I'm with Raj, I prefer those three over Baker. I'd probably put Ian Paice from Deep Purple over Baker too..

kala

mitchell was a contemporary/colleague
i agree that pace/ bonham were less tom oriented and more groove based and "funkier"
but that tom vibe is ginger's jazz thing and he was ahead of most everyone in 1966 [except for moonie]

fishmongerfunk

what about jimmy gordon?

The_Hook_Up

Mitch Mitchell is the greatest 60s rock drummer IMO. Listen to what he does on Live at Winterland...his drumming us just as nuts as Jimi's guitar playing. I think Moon is way overrated, he was perfect for the Who, but more than likely woulda sucked ass if he played with anyone else. Ginger Baker us just mehh to me.

utters

agreed on Mitch Mitchell, he had the jazz chops but knew how to rock a hard breakbeat

DrWu

If you ever want to hear something really funny check out the bonus Ginger Baker drum solo track on Fela and Ginger live. Dude just overplays so much. Unfunky white man especially compared to stool mate Tony Allen who just shreds with Fela.

Give me Bonham as far as classic rock drummers go. Crazy swing.

stratasphere

He aiight, but I have to agree with Crabmongerfunk mentioning Jim Gordon.

kala

mitchell was a contemporary/colleague
i agree that pace/ bonham were less tom oriented and more groove based and "funkier"
but that tom vibe is ginger's jazz thing and he was ahead of most everyone in 1966 [except for moon]

funky16corners

The_Hook_Up said:

Mitch Mitchell is the greatest 60s rock drummer IMO. Listen to what he does on Live at Winterland...his drumming us just as nuts as Jimi's guitar playing. I think Moon is way overrated, he was perfect for the Who, but more than likely woulda sucked ass if he played with anyone else. Ginger Baker us just mehh to me.

Moon is beyond overrated. He looked like he was doing a lot but that's about it.

As someone else already stated, Mitchell was a guy who had jazz and rock chops.

But, Bonham for the win.

Horseleech

Scott Asheton's drumming on Funhouse is some of the best rock drumming ever, imo.

stratasphere

While we're on the subject of British rock drummers I have to give an honorable mention to Bill Ward of Black Sabbath.

utters

stratasphere said:

While we're on the subject of British rock drummers I have to give an honorable mention to Bill Ward of Black Sabbath.

YES. the sabbath rhythm section is hugely underrated.

Big_Stacks

utters said:

stratasphere said:

While we're on the subject of British rock drummers I have to give an honorable mention to Bill Ward of Black Sabbath.

YES. the sabbath rhythm section is hugely underrated.

Also, don't sleep on Carmine Appice from Vanilla Fudge either.

Peace,

Big Stacks from Kakalak

Unknown

I guess I'd pick Moon but the genius that was Twink should not be forgotten.

Twink's solo LP is my favorite by far from a rock drummer.

And then there's Tony Williams, who could do it all.

kala

1966
double bass
he was first
thats all i was sayin
i too prefer bill ward,but i think cream influenced sabbath???heavily

The_Hook_Up

kala said:

1966
double bass
he was first
thats all i was sayin
i too prefer bill ward,but i think cream influenced sabbath???heavily

unfortunately, Bill did not play like this for long...shortly after this 1970 performace, his style changed for some reason...it was not nearly exciting, and he started playing a ginormous kit and did not swing as much, no more rolls, he got pretty boring.

p_gunn

BobDesperado said:

And then there's Tony Williams, who could do it all.

tony williams deads all debate re: bonham/baker/moon/paice/ward/mitcehll/etc...

he is the king and all solists dream to play over a dude like him...

kala said:

1966
double bass
he was first
thats all i was sayin
i too prefer bill ward,but i think cream influenced sabbath???heavily

yr right, he was the first to do double bass and not as a gimmick...

for british rock drummers, baker is the king... one, he came first so, yeah he was big influence on ward/bonham... he is the only real jazz cat amongst them all... they are all just faking the funk compared to him... mitch mitchell is great, but you never feel like he could have played in a jazz group for real for real... he's a jazz influneced rock drummer, whereas GB has actuall jazz skills... i like his feel for a back beat as well:



i remember going to the british library at king's cross and seeing a WWII exhibit w/ letters from solders home and one of them was from ginger baker's dad to him and his sister,,, apparenty he died right after the letter was sent...

i dunno, i have just always liked his drumming...

Unknown

p_gunn said:

BobDesperado said:

And then there's Tony Williams, who could do it all.

tony williams deads all debate re: bonham/baker/moon/paice/ward/mitcehll/etc...

he is the king and all solists dream to play over a dude like him...

kala said:

1966
double bass
he was first
thats all i was sayin
i too prefer bill ward,but i think cream influenced sabbath???heavily

yr right, he was the first to do double bass and not as a gimmick...

for british rock drummers, baker is the king... one, he came first so, yeah he was big influence on ward/bonham... he is the only real jazz cat amongst them all... they are all just faking the funk compared to him... mitch mitchell is great, but you never feel like he could have played in a jazz group for real for real... he's a jazz influneced rock drummer, whereas GB has actuall jazz skills... i like his feel for a back beat as well:



i remember going to the british library at king's cross and seeing a WWII exhibit w/ letters from solders home and one of them was from ginger baker's dad to him and his sister,,, apparenty he died right after the letter was sent...

i dunno, i have just always liked his drumming...

I know Stones hate runs deep around here but Charlie Watts has to be mentioned among British drummers with jazz chops.

Horseleech

Having Jazz chops is hardly a requirement in order to be a good rock drummer, in fact it often gets in the way.

The_Hook_Up

Granted Tony Williams is amazing , but he isn't a rock drummer...sure the Turn It Over LP is based in rock moves, but dude is a jazz drummer...not really someone to throw into this conversation. Elvin Jones has more creedence to be in this convo seeing how Ginger Baker once challanged him to a drum competition and as legend goes, Elvin made Ginger's arrogant ass look like an infant.

sabadabada

The_Hook_Up said:

Mitch Mitchell is the greatest 60s rock drummer IMO. Listen to what he does on Live at Winterland...his drumming us just as nuts as Jimi's guitar playing. I think Moon is way overrated, he was perfect for the Who, but more than likely woulda sucked ass if he played with anyone else. Ginger Baker us just mehh to me.

http://www.divshare.com/download/12603540-6b0

any excuse to post this out-take.

Not the best song, but I think the Axis sessions were Mitchell's best work.

But this instrumental version of Axis is so incredible. You have to listen to it on 11. You strip out the lyrics and the studio overdubbing and get down to just the trio, Jimi's genius becomes obvious. And when he steps on that fuzzbox at the 2:10 mark - get the fuck back. I'm sorry, but Clapton, the Who, the Stones, Beck, nobody could do shit like that. When it's over you feel like you've been swimming in the ocean.

LaserWolf

:face_melt:

sabadabada

I still can't locate the instrumental Third Stone out-take and its driving me crazy. I dug through my parents house looking for the old casette, been on line for hours - and there aren't that many occurences of Third Stone out there. I had it as a single side to a 60 minute casette given to me as "Pre-Experience Jams Germany". It was all instrumental and included Purple Haze, Third Stone, and the Star Spangled Banner (with the long cascading intro like he played at Woodstock but is cut from the original Woodstock recording) which makes me think that maybe the tape was mislabled as pre-experienc jams. And he played Third Stone live in Europe in 69 around the time he was playing the Star Spangled Banner. And I vaguly remember there bing some applause on the tape, but they were so abrupt it sonded dubbed. Anyway, the Third Stone is this amazing Jam and when he gets to the part where the song changes over to the spacey droning that sounds like a cello he can't get the feedback right and he keeps trying and it just keeps squeeking and then he finally gets it, and its like this long waaaahhhhhhhhhh-wahhh-wahhhhh. And then the drums and bass come back in and they go into the exit jam.

Mr_Lee_PHD

Bonham without a doubt in my book.

Pete Rivera from Raer Earth is another hot contender on my list (even though its not strictly rock). I never get tired of this solo. 4:26 is where is starts to cook - then simmer - then cook again.