amateur filmmakers inside, beginner needs advice

DjArcadian

Okay, I've always been a film nerd first and record collector second but I lost my lust for filmmaking years ago. Lately it's come back and I'm really looking to get into it. I have a lot of ideas I'm working on now. I'm looking into getting a good camcorder and some good editing equipment. I have a budget of about $4000. Want to buy stuff used. Been years since I've looked into this stuff.Used to be that the Canon Xl-1 was the go to camcorder. I've heard that 3 chip camcorders aren't even really necessary anymore for good quality recording. I'm most concerned about getting something which has some vibrant colors to it. Most consumer line camcorders always seemed to have dull colors or at least that was my experience years ago. As far as editing I'm pretty set on getting a Mac of some sort. Something used but what should I be looking for? Also, do the higher-end Macs come with Final Cut Pro already installed or do I need to purchase that separately? If I look towards the used market what should I get?Now what about storage? I want this to be pretty good quality. I used to import stuff into my old PC years ago and I remember it taking up an enormous amount of space on my PC. So much so that I would have to edit in segments and then get all the data off my computer and this was editing low quality bits at something ridiciously small like 320 X 320. Has video compression improved? I mean, if I got a 160GB drive or a 250GB drive presumably how much video would that store?Thanks in advance guys!

bthav

my sis has the 24p and that usta be the sought after joint on the digital hi-end world. its got that "laguna beach" "making the video" look. the idea is that it shoots 24 frames per sec, which is close or similar to film. this is all second hand info, so you should check it out for your self.

as far as FCP is concernd, im prety sure no macs come with installed unless you get some suped G5 that is billed specifically for editing. that being said, just find a friend in school to get the student discount.. so damn cheap.

and the storage really depends on the amount of video you are shooting... i really dont think compression has gotten better, but to give you an idea, my sis shot a 7 min short and i think had 120 gigs of video. but like i said, it depends on the amount of video you shoot--i think she shot like 4 hours worth of tape. hope this helps.

DjArcadian

my sis has the 24p and that usta be the sought after joint on the digital hi-end world. its got that "laguna beach" "making the video" look. the idea is that it shoots 24 frames per sec, which is close or similar to film. this is all second hand info, so you should check it out for your self.

I've heard of these but I'm really looking more at standard 30 FPS video.

soup

If you are serious about this (and can stomach a PC) you might want to look into some flavor of Avid Xpress. You should shoot 24 if you are trying to look like film and 30 if you are trying to look like video. I have no idea about cameras, I can't keep up. Firewire drives are cheap but if you start pressing up on HD resolution they can't provide the bandwidth. Cats mostly use SCSI but SATA might be a (much cheaper) possibility? And if you don't RAID 1 your shit (regardless of what interface you use) you're silly.

spelunk

Get a Panasonic DVX-100B, a new Mac w/a LOT of RAM, and Final Cut Pro as your base. The DVX-100B does 24p and 30i, and even though it's not HD, it's an amazing camera, pretty much the industry standard for low-budget digital. And for real man, Final Cut is the way to go, I've edited on it for a few years and it's flipping unbeatable unless you get the super high end Avid. Other than that you should definatley invest in a good portable shotgun mic, maybe some lights, and an all-weather camera case.

DjArcadian

You should shoot 24 if you are trying to look like film and 30 if you are trying to look like video.

Are you sure about that? How does the FPS effect the look of the video? I understand it's more ideal if you're looking to transfer to film but I'm not looking to do that yet.

DjArcadian

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sfc/sys/222696644.html

I found this just now. Looks like a good deal. Doesn't say specifically if it includes the Final Draft Pro software but I emailed dude asking about it. Assuming it does should I jump on it?

Meep

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sfc/sys/222696644.html

I found this just now. Looks like a good deal. Doesn't say specifically if it includes the Final Draft Pro software but I emailed dude asking about it. Assuming it does should I jump on it?

looks really cheap, better check if the software is legit (and which versions) if it's included

as far as storage, 1 minute of video usually = 1 gig

soup

Are you sure about that? How does the FPS effect the look of the video? I understand it's more ideal if you're looking to transfer to film but I'm not looking to do that yet.

24fps looks different than 30fps. 24fps with a 3:2 pulldown looks different than 30fps. Your brain can tell the difference. Not saying one or the other is better.


Some of the software "included" with that craigslist computer looks fishy. I'd at least want installer discs for any software you plan on using.

williedynamite

hey...
i'm a documentary filmmaker by trade. and here are my thoughts...

camera:

can't go wrong the panasonic dvx-100a or b. it's pretty much the indy-industry standard right now (for documentary). shoots in both 24p and standard 30p (29.97). only drawback is that it doesn't shoot hdv, which is where things seems to be headed.

next step up from panasonic is the hvx200, which does shoot hdv. but is also expensive $5000+ and uses $1000 memory cards instead of tapes.

an alternate if you want HDV would be the sony hvr-a1u. it looks like a toy, but shoots in hdv (and mini-dv) and gives a very high quality image for the cost and size. i think they go for around $2500.

sony hvr-z1u is also a good option, but pricy ($4500). it feels alot like the sony pd-170, has a butter manual zoom, and shoots very high quality hdv (as well as standard mini-dv).

software:
i'd go with mac and run fcp 5.0. again, the indy-stry standard as far as documentary is concerned.

storage:
depends mostly on how many tapes you're working with. a general conversion is 12-13GB per hour of footage. start big though... you'll always need more space. also make sure you get a drive that has a very high data transfer rate. that will make it easier to work with hd footage if you choose to do so.

hope this was helpful

:wd

DjArcadian

hey...
i'm a documentary filmmaker by trade. and here are my thoughts...

camera:

can't go wrong the panasonic dvx-100a or b. it's pretty much the indy-industry standard right now (for documentary). shoots in both 24p and standard 30p (29.97). only drawback is that it doesn't shoot hdv, which is where things seems to be headed.

next step up from panasonic is the hvx200, which does shoot hdv. but is also expensive $5000+ and uses $1000 memory cards instead of tapes.

an alternate if you want HDV would be the sony hvr-a1u. it looks like a toy, but shoots in hdv (and mini-dv) and gives a very high quality image for the cost and size. i think they go for around $2500.

sony hvr-z1u is also a good option, but pricy ($4500). it feels alot like the sony pd-170, has a butter manual zoom, and shoots very high quality hdv (as well as standard mini-dv).

software:
i'd go with mac and run fcp 5.0. again, the indy-stry standard as far as documentary is concerned.

storage:
depends mostly on how many tapes you're working with. a general conversion is 12-13GB per hour of footage. start big though... you'll always need more space. also make sure you get a drive that has a very high data transfer rate. that will make it easier to work with hd footage if you choose to do so.

hope this was helpful

:wd

Thanks!

Your post was extremely helpful.

Thanks to everyone!

spelunk

That is a ridiculously good deal, those Aja Kona cards are dope. The one thing though is that if you're going to be working with uncompressed video (as the Aja can do) you're gonna need a huge RAID system for storage.

DjArcadian

Question. Are any of these high end video cameras able to film in slow motion? How is that achieved in video?

spelunk

Question. Are any of these high end video cameras able to film in slow motion? How is that achieved in video?

Cheaply, it can be done by frame-blending, unless you're talking super slow motion. If you want the real deal, that might only come with more pro level cameras.