Doomsday VS. Octagynocologist

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  • Production-wise.....the Keith jawn is probably ahead.

    I dunno....they're both good....Doomsday has heart for days though man.

  • deejdeej 5,125 Posts
    Sipping manischewitz smooth, your cute
    drinking Henesy joke about 2 girls
    your friends double teaming me
    I got the office closed
    you ready for the pros
    suckers aint no good
    sticking coke up in your nose
    my style is wild at home
    and on the kitchen table
    porno flicks and stacks
    play good on the TV cable
    I'd rather sign my address on your application
    you can call late nights for lonely information
    when you come when its boring
    no place where to go
    I want you in a two peace
    and freak me for a private show
    you got my number, address, you know the rest

  • rootlesscosmorootlesscosmo 12,848 Posts


    Kool Keith > MF in terms of lyrics on the albums.

    Rootless, you gonna let this shit stand?

    Dudes. Doomsday


    yeah I really don't think this is worth arguing about. I mean, it's not even a defensible position.

    While I have no doubt some of you Octagon partisans have actually listened to Doomsday, I wonder how many of y'all have really weighed the relative merits lyrically[/b] .

    I can see how it would be hard for some of you who are "wowed by Kieth's far-out super space style!!" to really compare, verse-for-verse, this album against Doomsday. It's easy to lose sight of Doom's lyrics amidst the beats and lowkey voice. But they're fresh. I mean REALLY fresh lyrics start to finish.

    Octagon is on some tired stream-of-consiousness-surgical-sex talk.

    Doomsday is front to back coherent lyricism, hilarious metaphors and references, and multiple (count em!) rhyme styles. He's even got some stories on there. Plus the beats are fresh.

    Octagon is but a lark, a momentary distraction from the magnum opus that is Doomsday.

    [I just think it's funny how many people (not you Batmon) have openly admitted in this thread to not actually having listened to Doomsday whilst proclaiming Octagon the superior album. There should be two separate appreciation threads basically.]

  • tripledoubletripledouble 7,636 Posts


    easily, clearly, far and away better

    its got rhymes like dimes

  • faux_rillzfaux_rillz 14,343 Posts

    [I just think it's funny how many people (not you Batmon) have openly admitted in this thread to not actually having listened to Doomsday whilst proclaiming Octagon the superior album. There should be two separate appreciation threads basically.]

    I've never even listened to Doomsday and I'm still riding for it--because I have listened to Dr. Octagon.

  • LamontLamont 1,089 Posts
    Most people have a warped view of the Octagon album because it had the Mo'Wax/Dreamworks stamp on it and thus got promo'd towards that crowd, Doom became Pitchfork posterboy AFTER said album so...

    Both 9/10


    I feel a horrible mash-up project coming up.

  • mrmatthewmrmatthew 1,575 Posts
    I feel a horrible mash-up project coming up.

    Dr. Doomynocolgist Day

  • lepoohpoohlepoohpooh 296 Posts
    Doomsday - no contest

    "Doo-doo-doo-doo-doo!" That's a audio daily double
    Rappers need to fall off just to save me the trouble, yo
    Watch your own back
    Came in and go out alone, black
    Stay in the zone - turn H2O to Cognac"

  • jleejlee 1,539 Posts

    [I just think it's funny how many people (not you Batmon) have openly admitted in this thread to not actually having listened to Doomsday whilst proclaiming Octagon the superior album. There should be two separate appreciation threads basically.]

    I've never even listened to Doomsday and I'm still riding for it--because I have listened to Dr. Octagon.

    i recall reading a very positive review for Dr. Octagon back in '97 while i was in HS. On the strength of that review, i went out and bought the CD. But apparently i wasn't paying attention (or the gods were looking out for me) because I picked up the instrumental only. I was a fanboy of Q-Bert back than and also really dug the tripped out automater beats, so i joined the bandwagon of people touting this cd/lp. It wasn't until about 2 months later that i heard the vocal cd, at which point in time i think i realized that i never could be a huge fan of nonsensical rap.

    I'd probably give the thumbs up to Doomsday, if only for the fact that i kinda understand what MF is rapping about....I think

  • Imperial_MaoImperial_Mao 1,119 Posts
    Is Dr Octagon[/b] really any different from the 10 or so albums Kool Keith released in the following 4-5 years? Cuz I heard all of those and they stink ! [/b]

  • UnherdUnherd 1,880 Posts

    I can see some of you are "wowed by Kieth's far-out super space style[/b]!!" Octagon is on some tired stream-of-consiousness-surgical-sex talk.[/b]

    Doomsday is front to back coherent lyricism, hilarious metaphors and references,[/b] and multiple (count em!) rhyme styles. He's even got some stories[/b] on there. Plus[/b] the beats are fresh.

    Doomsday is a magnum opus.[/b]

  • G_BalliandoG_Balliando 3,916 Posts
    Is Dr Octagon[/b] really any different from the 10 or so albums Kool Keith released in the following 4-5 years? Cuz I heard all of those and they stink ! [/b]

    They've definitely both had a lot of albums, although I think MF doom has had more since 99 than Keith has had since 96, especially if you include the Special Herbs 1-10 that MF Doom released (were those all albums or more like beat tapes?). The argument could definitely be made that both artists put out a lot of material that sounded the same, but I think MF Doom moreso than Keith, but that's just me. Neither of these dudes are hitting anywhere near my radar at this point anyway. They both stink to me! The difference is, Kool Keith is more likely to make me laugh. MF Doom just sounds sad when he raps. Like he needs a hug.

  • deejdeej 5,125 Posts
    doc oc ain't a terrible album at all, some joints on there
    anti-nerd bias folks are fronting

  • Trick thread - they're both classics, true classics, for utterly opposing reasons.

    Both 'camps' are right, but for my personal listening preference Doomsday wins quite easily.

  • Mike_BellMike_Bell 5,736 Posts
    I ride for Doomsday, all day. What's the science with the Dr. Octagon record anyways?

  • G_BalliandoG_Balliando 3,916 Posts
    What's the science

  • faux_rillzfaux_rillz 14,343 Posts
    doc oc ain't a terrible album at all, some joints on there
    anti-nerd bias folks are fronting

    Jointz and jamz, even?

    Do you party?

  • deejdeej 5,125 Posts
    doc oc ain't a terrible album at all, some joints on there
    anti-nerd bias folks are fronting

    Jointz and jamz, even?

    Do you party?
    i'm saying tho! the lack of recognition for 'girl' proves this
    this album is not all science and nerd shit, nor is it KOOL KETIH THAT GUY IS CRAZY (although sadly for 90% of its fanbase this seems to be the case)

  • rawmanrawman 16 Posts


    i'm still waiting for part two to this. wasn't feeling everything that came after this album.

    Check King Geedorah (take me to your leador-ah). As for the debate, Doomsday wins in a landslide.

  • SIRUSSIRUS 2,554 Posts


    i'm still waiting for part two to this. wasn't feeling everything that came after this album.

    Check King Geedorah (take me to your leador-ah). As for the debate, Doomsday wins in a landslide.
    i've listened to it, but it dosen't have the same soul that doomsday has. plus i'd rather hear doom rap over his productions than anyone else (except for jorge, i'd love to hear a new album from him).

  • autoauto 198 Posts
    doomsday is better

  • Young_PhonicsYoung_Phonics 8,039 Posts

    [I just think it's funny how many people (not you Batmon) have openly admitted in this thread to not actually having listened to Doomsday whilst proclaiming Octagon the superior album. There should be two separate appreciation threads basically.]

    I've never even listened to Doomsday and I'm still riding for it--because I have listened to Dr. Octagon.

    Same here.

    Deej:

    Yeah that Sade track is great. I put it on hip-hop mixa few years ago (Faux Rillz even enjoyed it!).

  • mandrewmandrew 2,720 Posts
    to all them rap ass niggas wit ya half assed rhymes talkin bout how much you get high, how much weed you smoke and that crazy space shit that don't even make no sense:[/b] don't ever speak to me when you see me, knowaimsaying? Word. Imma have to get on some ol' high school shit, start punchin niggas in they face just for livin. Yo, I'm finnished what I had to say, ya'll can continue on.

    to be fair though, i never really cared as much as prodigy about all this. you can talk about drugs, space, sex, peace, flowers, or bumblebees for all i care... its all about the beats, yo!. and automator hooked up dr octo in this category.

  • HAZHAZ 3,376 Posts
    Is Dr Octagon[/b] really any different from the 10 or so albums Kool Keith released in the following 4-5 years? Cuz I heard all of those and they stink ! [/b]

    I recently checked out the Project Polaroid lp & was surprised by its quality. By far, it was the best Kool Keith album I've heard in years.

    Also, I liked Octagon. Never really dug Doomsday all that much, but I've been meaning to revisit it. I think that the case could be made that both albums come out of that mid-90's freakazoid, scientifical, poindexter steez, a sound that hasn't aged all that well to my ears. Put "Funcrusher Plus" into the mix & you have the holy trinty of weirdo sci-fi rap.

  • kitchenknightkitchenknight 4,922 Posts
    Dudes. Doomsday.

    DUDES.

    IT IS DOOM!

    The first time I heard Doom, I thought I would hate it; to put that in perspective, I think that was off clips on Sandbox Automatic. My boy told me, 'Listen to the whole thing. You'll like it." He was right. I still think it's held up all these years later. Soulful, original, and unbelivably entertaining.

  • UnherdUnherd 1,880 Posts
    I feel you, but I think while Doc Oc has some really dope automator stuff, generally the beats are just not that different from other stuff out there, just better. Automator does have a distinct, dope sound. It's not that his shit isnt quality, its just not that groundbreaking. However, while the comic book alter-ego thing had been done before, don't be fooled by the lo-fi sound. The beats on Doomsday, are really on some other shit conceptually. The dude who did the cover once told me that most of that album is samples doom caught on CD101.9 ('smooth' jazz for non new yorkers) Just saying, I think thats what doom fans mean when they see the comparison as ridiculous. For me, Doom is the quintessential underground concept album, and while some scoff at the category, between the one of kind 'smooth' beats, rhyme styles, references and overall conceptual coherence, that album stands alone, as an unmatched undergound album. To me, Doc Oc just sounds like goofily contrived 'crazy' rhymes over dope automator beats.

  • rootlesscosmorootlesscosmo 12,848 Posts


    Also, I liked Octagon. Never really dug Doomsday all that much, but I've been meaning to revisit it. I think that the case could be made that both albums come out of that mid-90's freakazoid, scientifical, poindexter steez, a sound that hasn't aged all that well to my ears. Put "Funcrusher Plus" into the mix & you have the holy trinty of weirdo sci-fi rap.

    H*ward you got it twisted, son!

    Seriously there's nothing remotely [/b] freakazoid, scientifical about Doomsday, though I can totally see how one could draw that conclusion from the cover art + cartoon-themed title + occasional comic book and cartoon references + general freakazoid, scientifical milieu of the time it was released.

    However, if you give it a serious, unadulterated listen, you will see that Doom's on some straight street-level, down-to-earth subject matter with a healthy dose of often-subtle comedy.

    I always thought this tape got its proper recognition (some liked it; some didn't) but I am beginning to think it may be criminally slept on among the Strut massive.

  • faux_rillzfaux_rillz 14,343 Posts


    Also, I liked Octagon. Never really dug Doomsday all that much, but I've been meaning to revisit it. I think that the case could be made that both albums come out of that mid-90's freakazoid, scientifical, poindexter steez, a sound that hasn't aged all that well to my ears. Put "Funcrusher Plus" into the mix & you have the holy trinty of weirdo sci-fi rap.

    H*ward you got it twisted, son!

    Seriously there's nothing remotely [/b] freakazoid, scientifical about Doomsday, though I can totally see how one could draw that conclusion from the cover art + cartoon-themed title + occasional comic book and cartoon references + general freakazoid, scientifical milieu of the time it was released.

    You sound mad defensive about your taste for freakazoid scientifical rap, son!

  • cascas 1,484 Posts

    from the cover art + cartoon-themed title + occasional comic book and cartoon references + general freakazoid,

    ummmm...i'm gonna go ahead and guess that the answer is 23, chad. is that close? this must be that "new math" that all the youngins are hollering about.

  • rootlesscosmorootlesscosmo 12,848 Posts


    Also, I liked Octagon. Never really dug Doomsday all that much, but I've been meaning to revisit it. I think that the case could be made that both albums come out of that mid-90's freakazoid, scientifical, poindexter steez, a sound that hasn't aged all that well to my ears. Put "Funcrusher Plus" into the mix & you have the holy trinty of weirdo sci-fi rap.

    H*ward you got it twisted, son!

    Seriously there's nothing remotely [/b] freakazoid, scientifical about Doomsday, though I can totally see how one could draw that conclusion from the cover art + cartoon-themed title + occasional comic book and cartoon references + general freakazoid, scientifical milieu of the time it was released.

    You sound mad defensive about your taste for freakazoid scientifical rap, son!

    seriously once you peep the album you'll see how inane a comparison this thread represents.
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