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Saigon = full of shit?

SouthCrackalackSouthCrackalack 3,853 Posts
edited January 2006 in Strut Central
if he aint contradicting his own rhymes on MTV skits, he is talking shit about down south. Not to smart when trying to sell records.. and in honor of Phil: Cedric Muhammad: Now, another area where I have liked what you have had to say is the current environment and this whole dynamic where the South rapper is ???in??? now, and I was laughing when I heard you say, ???It is hard for a New York rapper now to make it (now)...' (laughter)Saigon: Yeah. What? (laughter). That is why all of these dudes now, feel like they have to go down there and collaborate with a Down South artist and make these songs that sound country-driven. Yeah, it is real hard. I feel like ??? not to dis the South, because my family is from the South and my mother is from the South - but I feel like, they have kind of dumbed the Hip-Hop down so much, that it is like anybody can grasp it now, and it is more accessible and entertaining to everyone, and anyone can catch on to it now. They were always considered slower than us. The Down South mo??? f-----s was always considered slow. Like up here in New York, we were always considered more advanced than Down South people. Now it is like the tail wagging the dog. Now, it is like the slow people are leading the advanced. The slow mo??? f-----rs is like in control of shit because the majority rules. And there is more slow people, so now that is what is in effect. So now the people who like to hear insight and introspective lyrics and like to grow and learn ??? you can???t learn from a Down South record. There are a few groups like David Banner and Outkast (that you can learn from). It???s a few of them.He also said on a freestyle over Trina???s ???B B Right??? produced by Kanye West and said???I don't be rapping over no down south aw man down south shit, I don't be rapping over no Ludacris type shit man I'm gangsta???"Everybody else dickridin' down south niggas, I ain't gonna jump on that shit"Here is the clip. Now none of this adds up. If you're doing a mixtape with the hottest DJ out right now who resides in Atlanta, what do you call that? According to what Saigon has said that is what is called dickriding. Why would he straight up hate on south music just because he dropped 200 mixtapes and no one outside of east coast was paying attention to him? He has been sitting on Atlantic for about a year still dropping mixtapes while the south continues to be hot. I guess he got tired of doing the whole setup, punch line, simile track so he comes down south to be noticed. What makes Saigon more advanced then a southern artist? ???So now the people who like to hear insight and introspective lyrics and like to grow and learn ??? you can???t learn from a Down South record.??? - Saigon
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  Comments

  • twoplytwoply Only Built 4 Manzanita Links 2,914 Posts
    Saigon: Yeah. What? (laughter). That is why all of these dudes now, feel like they have to go down there and collaborate with a Down South artist and make these songs that sound country-driven. Yeah, it is real hard. I feel like ??? not to dis the South, because my family is from the South and my mother is from the South - but I feel like, they have kind of dumbed the Hip-Hop down so much, that it is like anybody can grasp it now, and it is more accessible and entertaining to everyone, and anyone can catch on to it now. They were always considered slower than us. The Down South mo??? f-----s was always considered slow. Like up here in New York, we were always considered more advanced than Down South people. Now it is like the tail wagging the dog. Now, it is like the slow people are leading the advanced. The slow mo??? f-----rs is like in control of shit because the majority rules. And there is more slow people, so now that is what is in effect. So now the people who like to hear insight and introspective lyrics and like to grow and learn ??? you can???t learn from a Down South record. There are a few groups like David Banner and Outkast (that you can learn from). It???s a few of them.

    So, how far off is this assesment then?

  • SouthCrackalackSouthCrackalack 3,853 Posts
    I think the whole NY(or up north) is smarter than down south is bullshit.
  • street_muzikstreet_muzik 3,919 Posts
  • street_muzikstreet_muzik 3,919 Posts
  • twoplytwoply Only Built 4 Manzanita Links 2,914 Posts
    I think the whole NY(or up north) is smarter than down south is bullshit.

    True, that's a very subjective statement. But it seems to me like the South has done something to make rap more palatable for the masses. I fully admit I'm not exactly qualified to debate the issue, though, seeing as how I'm from Oregon.
  • SouthCrackalackSouthCrackalack 3,853 Posts
    I just dont think shitting on a whole region(that happens to be the hottest thing in rap since dookie ropes)is a smart thing to do for a rapper that wants to sell records.



    maybe I am just mad.
  • street_muzikstreet_muzik 3,919 Posts
    I think the whole NY(or up north) is smarter than down south is bullshit.

    True, that's a very subjective statement. But it seems to me like the South has done something to make rap more palatable for the masses. I fully admit I'm not exactly qualified to debate the issue, though, seeing as how I'm from Oregon.

    C'mon! You're American aren't you?
  • faux_rillzfaux_rillz 14,343 Posts
    Saigon: Yeah. What? (laughter). That is why all of these dudes now, feel like they have to go down there and collaborate with a Down South artist and make these songs that sound country-driven. Yeah, it is real hard. I feel like ??? not to dis the South, because my family is from the South and my mother is from the South - but I feel like, they have kind of dumbed the Hip-Hop down so much, that it is like anybody can grasp it now, and it is more accessible and entertaining to everyone, and anyone can catch on to it now. They were always considered slower than us. The Down South mo??? f-----s was always considered slow. Like up here in New York, we were always considered more advanced than Down South people. Now it is like the tail wagging the dog. Now, it is like the slow people are leading the advanced. The slow mo??? f-----rs is like in control of shit because the majority rules. And there is more slow people, so now that is what is in effect. So now the people who like to hear insight and introspective lyrics and like to grow and learn ??? you can???t learn from a Down South record. There are a few groups like David Banner and Outkast (that you can learn from). It???s a few of them.




    So, how far off is this assesment then?






    There are really two separate issues here: one can be critical of New York's loss of identity (a point on which I agree with Saigon), without indulging in all of the hatterific "the South is backwards and lyrically unsophisticated" rhetoric.



    The problem is not Southern rappers; it is New York rappers' attempts to emulate them.
  • BsidesBsides 4,244 Posts
    are you sure he said that shit? Wheres the quote from? Cause if so hes getting booted from my ipod.
  • Big_StacksBig_Stacks "I don't worry about hittin' power, cause I don't give 'em nuttin' to hit." 4,670 Posts
    Hey,

    Quite honestly, I think Saigon is absolutely right!!!! Don't get me wrong, his blanket statement is not applicable to all "down south" artists, as he acknowledged himself by singling out Outkast and David Banner. But, rap music has definitely downplayed the role of "MCin'" in terms of mic skills, clever lyrics, and delivery. This probably explains why I don't feel down south stuff, in that it largely seems stupid and infantile to me. Back in the day, even if a NY MC wasn't saying "world changing" shit, at least he said it in a clever, interesting way. Sorry, but MC's saying dumb shit in a simple way will never ever be appealing to me. For me, though, I don't care where an MC is from as long as they can rhyme (I mean REALLY rhyme), and have some nice beats. Overall, down south shit does not move me on either of these counts (rhymes or beats).

    Peace,

    Big Stacks from Kakalak
  • FunkyFlatulentFunkyFlatulent 1,106 Posts
    I do agree with him (sorry )

    BUT.. Saigon recently took a shot at the Notorious BIG in one of his songs. So FUCK SAIGON. I'm officially not supporting him.
  • faux_rillzfaux_rillz 14,343 Posts
    Hey,



    Quite honestly, I think Saigon is absolutely right!!!! Don't get me wrong, his blanket statement is not applicable to all "down south" artists, as he acknowledged himself by singling out Outkast and David Banner. But, rap music has definitely downplayed the role of "MCin'" in terms of mic skills, clever lyrics, and delivery. This probably explains why I don't feel down south stuff, in that it largely seems stupid and infantile to me.



    Dude, you are an admitted fan of the Cella Dwellas...
  • BsidesBsides 4,244 Posts
    Oh no, were not even having that down south music ruined hip hop argument over here. This thread is about how saigon is full of shit. If you agree that southern people have always been slow, then you need your head checked.


  • faux_rillzfaux_rillz 14,343 Posts
    If you agree that southern people have always been slow, then you need your head checked.

    I am here to check real headz...
  • SouthCrackalackSouthCrackalack 3,853 Posts
    yeah, I really dont even care about getting into an "I dont like down south rap because is ignorant" debate. I just think this dude Saigon seems to be full of shit. But then again..maybe I am just "slow"
  • canonicalcanonical 2,100 Posts

    Saigon: Yeah. What? (laughter). That is why all of these dudes now, feel like they have to go down there and collaborate with a Down South artist and make these songs that sound country-driven. Yeah, it is real hard. I feel like ??? not to dis the South, because my family is from the South and my mother is from the South - but I feel like, they have kind of dumbed the Hip-Hop down so much, that it is like anybody can grasp it now, and it is more accessible and entertaining to everyone, and anyone can catch on to it now[/b]. They were always considered slower than us. The Down South mo??? f-----s was always considered slow. Like up here in New York, we were always considered more advanced than Down South people. Now it is like the tail wagging the dog. Now, it is like the slow people are leading the advanced. The slow mo??? f-----rs is like in control of shit because the majority rules. And there is more slow people, so now that is what is in effect. So now the people who like to hear insight and introspective lyrics and like to grow and learn ??? you can???t learn from a Down South record. There are a few groups like David Banner and Outkast (that you can learn from). It???s a few of them.
    Sounds like good marketing to me (and that isn't necesarilly a good thing).
  • canonicalcanonical 2,100 Posts
    yeah, I really dont even care about getting into an "I dont like down south rap because is ignorant" debate. I just think this dude Saigon seems to be full of shit. But then again..maybe I am just "slow"
    This may help

  • LamontLamont 1,089 Posts
    (Just Blaze): [...] If you try to make a mainstream record like "Fight the Power" now, people think you're crazy. There hasn't been a place for that in the mainstream since then. But right now with what Kanye's doing, Common getting hot again and Styles P talking about being black and proud, there are signs that people want something different. At least I hope that will happen, because I can not listen to any more crack raps.

    (Saigon): That's been my purpose since day one. Of course we're gonna sell records, we're in the business of selling records. But I want to be remembered for more than that. Thirty years from now, when we look back on who did what in hip-hop, we're gonna see that 50 Cent made a song about "Candyshop, come lick my lollipop." Meanwhile we were trying to open doors in people's minds and better the conditions for our people in the hood.


    Saigon is ok in my book, one or two faux-pas don't bother me.
  • soulmarcosasoulmarcosa 4,296 Posts
    Like up here in New York, we were always considered more advanced than Down South people.

    Thirty years from now, when we look back on who did what in hip-hop, we're gonna see that 50 Cent made a song about "Candyshop, come lick my lollipop."

    Where's the "self-sonned" graemlin again?
  • magneticmagnetic 2,678 Posts
    Saigon's problem is that he's on this i'm "realer than the next rapper" campaign,and it's getting tired,also his style is too quirky to be taken seriously.I dont see him as the saviour for NYC rapmusic by any stretch of the imagination.
  • street_muzikstreet_muzik 3,919 Posts
    Like up here in New York, we were always considered more advanced than Down South people.

    Thirty years from now, when we look back on who did what in hip-hop, we're gonna see that 50 Cent made a song about "Candyshop, come lick my lollipop."

    Where's the "self-sonned" graemlin again?

    How 'bout a KRS-1 graemlin. He always contradicts himself. Who doesn't?
  • hertzhoghertzhog 865 Posts
    For someone as conscious and whatnot, his anti-gay stuff seems pretty questionable to me also-- in that one song he asks God: "Do you have more love for gay men than young black African Americans."
  • izm707izm707 1,107 Posts
    it's all a marketing campain...the fact that we talk about it here makes it efficient. Who really cares about the truth (aka Tha Trouf)...People are here to stack money "while" attempting to deliver good music. It's just unfortunate that ma,y don't deliver good music anymore. Because the paper chase makes you think and learn about marketing and promotion...too bad for the artistic part. People try to capitalize, target and collect. Saigon is just like that because he went in jail "for a while" and he a five percenter. He reminds me of the old days when Brooklyn was on top...lol. He's not that different from any 5er i know. He's just putting some sarcastic twist to his speech, read some books, and quote some old heads. I like him for what he represents tho'...I could care less about his views on gays or sourthern rappers. That's up to me and me only. I don't need him to draw my conclusions.



    Now listent to "the letter p" with that Styx sample. It's hotter than a pussy after sex.
  • 33thirdcom33thirdcom 2,049 Posts
    I'll wait til his album with Just Blaze drops since he is an artist, not a politician. Quotes and interviews are whatever these days.

    The Saigon Mix CD is fire...
  • izm707izm707 1,107 Posts
    i should have said that, it was shorter...i'm gonna quote you next time.
  • SwayzeSwayze 14,705 Posts
    it's all a marketing campain...the fact that we talk about it here makes it efficient. Who really cares about the truth (aka Tha Trouf)...People are here to stack money "while" attempting to deliver good music. It's just unfortunate that ma,y don't deliver good music anymore. Because the paper chase makes you think and learn about marketing and promotion...too bad for the artistic part. People try to capitalize, target and collect. Saigon is just like that because he went in jail "for a while" and he a five percenter. He reminds me of the old days when Brooklyn was on top...lol. He's not that different from any 5er i know. He's just putting some sarcastic twist to his speech, read some books, and quote some old heads. I like him for what he represents tho'...I could care less about his views on gays or sourthern rappers. That's up to me and me only. I don't need him to draw my conclusions.

    Now listent to "the letter p" with that Styx sample. It's hotter than a pussy after sex.

    it sucks that blatant hypocrisy is a viable marketing strategy. that's some republican shit.
  • 33thirdcom33thirdcom 2,049 Posts
    I am not sure its blatant hypocrisy. Him being on a southern mix CD may be a favor for a friend, he may not have known his vocals were going to be put on that track... We're all looking at it from the outside, and don't know 99% of what is going on in these deals. And the 50Cent quote? That doesn't say hypocrite, he is making a point about the potential legacy of the biggest NYC rapper's out now, versus what he is trying to do.
  • magneticmagnetic 2,678 Posts

    The Saigon Mix CD is fire...

    Which one? if it's the Dj Drama/Saigon - "Welcome to Saigon" joint,it's just a rehash of stuff that can be found on other(Saigon) mixtapes with a handful of new songs thrown in.That's so weak if you ask me,thank god for the free album downloads online.
  • Big_StacksBig_Stacks "I don't worry about hittin' power, cause I don't give 'em nuttin' to hit." 4,670 Posts
    Hey,



    Quite honestly, I think Saigon is absolutely right!!!! Don't get me wrong, his blanket statement is not applicable to all "down south" artists, as he acknowledged himself by singling out Outkast and David Banner. But, rap music has definitely downplayed the role of "MCin'" in terms of mic skills, clever lyrics, and delivery. This probably explains why I don't feel down south stuff, in that it largely seems stupid and infantile to me.



    Dude, you are an admitted fan of the Cella Dwellas...



    That's right, and at least they have (or had) flows better than those simple-Simon southern flows that are predominate these days. Why does popular have to equal stupid or simplistic? I guess it just reflects the (general lack of) intellect of the American populace nowadays (check the latest ranking of nations educationally according to the National Assessment of Educational Progress).



    Peace,



    Big Stacks from Kakalak
  • Jonny_PaycheckJonny_Paycheck 17,825 Posts
    Hey,

    Quite honestly, I think Saigon is absolutely right!!!! Don't get me wrong, his blanket statement is not applicable to all "down south" artists, as he acknowledged himself by singling out Outkast and David Banner. But, rap music has definitely downplayed the role of "MCin'" in terms of mic skills, clever lyrics, and delivery. This probably explains why I don't feel down south stuff, in that it largely seems stupid and infantile to me.

    Dude, you are an admitted fan of the Cella Dwellas...

    That's right, and at least they have (or had) flows better than those simple-Simon southern flows that are predominate these days. Why does popular have to equal stupid or simplistic? I guess it just reflects the (general lack of) intellect of the American populace nowadays (check the latest ranking of nations educationally according to the National Assessment of Educational Progress).

    Peace,

    Big Stacks from Kakalak

    I think what Mr. Rillz was pointing out was that just being complicated doesn't make something good...
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