I think Skuf lives in my neighborhood cause I always see fresh tags around my way. Skuf the shit. I seen some new tags he copped with JA over on Flatbush recently.
JA, that's another killer. Dudes like that are on some real grimey graff shit, all tags and throw upas and straight letters. That was nuts how he dissed that Saber river piece. So many heads were emotional over that one!! That's what graff's all about. I got a lot of respect for Saber but dissing something on that level takes some massive cojones!
JA is legendary just because he's always been so much larger than life, and that was reflected in the way that he got up. Massive respect to that crazy motherfucker.
Most graff is lame. Waling up to a subway car in the 70's and seeing "DEATH" painted on it was probably an amazing thing. Now that there are fucking textbooks, and graffiti stores you have to question whether emulation really counts for anything. 'Urban" masterpieces are lame. Splasher is no different than Fairey, or any of these other dudes because it's just a matter of jacking the shine; the lame-o audience that cares about this kind of garbage is the same either way.
I'm definitely feeling elbowtoe, straight line mean streaks.
billbradleyYou want BBQ sauce? Get the fuck out of my house. 2,905 Posts
I don't really keep up with graffiti art much but one of my friends showed me some of Daim's work recently. I like his 3D style.
Most graff is lame. Waling up to a subway car in the 70's and seeing "DEATH" painted on it was probably an amazing thing. Now that there are fucking textbooks, and graffiti stores you have to question whether emulation really counts for anything. 'Urban" masterpieces are lame. Splasher is no different than Fairey, or any of these other dudes because it's just a matter of jacking the shine; the lame-o audience that cares about this kind of garbage is the same either way.
I'm definitely feeling elbowtoe, straight line mean streaks.
sorry, but you sound completely
graff is ALL ABOUT FAME and nothing else. While I could give 2 shits about "the splasher" or obey, the fame element that they seek is the purest part of what they do in relation to graffiti. Graffiti was never really that difficult to begin with, just because it's more mainstream now than it was in the 70s doesn't make it less interesting or less credible. Just because you can walk into a store and buy the markers I used to spend hours making in the basement doesn't mean that everybody who uses that marker lacks credibility.
However, I agree that a good portion of graff is lame, but that's always been the case. There's always been toys. But toys grow up to be kings, everybody starts somewhere, and the game is just a little more advanced now.
I kinda like the art part of it. Do you really get pleasure from seeing the same ugly ass throw up a billion times? To say it's ALL about fame isn't really giving Graf very much credit IMO.
I kinda like the art part of it. Do you really get pleasure from seeing the same ugly ass throw up a billion times? To say it's ALL about fame isn't really giving Graf very much credit IMO.
when you live in a half ass city with a few toyish tags here and there, it's pretty easy to get fame. But in a city where EVERYONE writes, and the saturation itself takes on a whole new life, it's pretty impressive when someone is able to stand out in quantity. Remember, graffiti is all about being under pressure. That's where stylish throwups and tags came from.
I kinda like the art part of it. Do you really get pleasure from seeing the same ugly ass throw up a billion times? To say it's ALL about fame isn't really giving Graf very much credit IMO.
No offense, but that sounds exactly like what someone who doesn't really understand this game would say.
I kinda like the art part of it. Do you really get pleasure from seeing the same ugly ass throw up a billion times? To say it's ALL about fame isn't really giving Graf very much credit IMO.
when you live in a half ass city with a few toyish tags here and there, it's pretty easy to get fame. But in a city where EVERYONE writes, and the saturation itself takes on a whole new life, it's pretty impressive when someone is able to stand out in quantity. Remember, graffiti is all about being under pressure. That's where stylish throwups and tags came from.
i have more to add...
We also come from a generation where kids know 100x more corporate brands than types of plants. That's a fact. Is it any surprise that they would want to create their own brand?
I kinda like the art part of it. Do you really get pleasure from seeing the same ugly ass throw up a billion times? To say it's ALL about fame isn't really giving Graf very much credit IMO.
No offense, but that sounds exactly like what someone who doesn't really understand this game would say.
who are you responding to? the fame? or the art? if you're saying that style and creativity aren't crucial, then
I wrote from age 12 til I got caught red handed in 2001. do I not understand the game? style is major. and a punk attitude is also neccesary. I would do it just as much just for the thrill of doing something wrong as I would for getting fame.
when you live in a half ass city with a few toyish tags here and there, it's pretty easy to get fame. But in a city where EVERYONE writes, and the saturation itself takes on a whole new life, it's pretty impressive when someone is able to stand out in quantity. Remember, graffiti is all about being under pressure. That's where stylish throwups and tags came from.
It ain't hard to get fame where I live. I understand the game of "getting up", I just really like the artistic side of Graf more, that's what attracted me too it when I was young (not to mention the rush involved when doing a piece!). I just think there's more to it then "fame", if it wasn't then people wouldn't hate on dudes like the "Splasher".
I kinda like the art part of it. Do you really get pleasure from seeing the same ugly ass throw up a billion times? To say it's ALL about fame isn't really giving Graf very much credit IMO.
No offense, but that sounds exactly like what someone who doesn't really understand this game would say.
who are you responding to? the fame? or the art? if you're saying that style and creativity aren't crucial, then
I wrote from age 12 til I got caught red handed in 2001. do I not understand the game? style is major. and a punk attitude is also neccesary. I would do it just as much just for the thrill of doing something wrong as I would for getting fame.
I was responding to Pony I think, but style and relentlessness go hand in hand in the making of a thoroughbred, and one element without the other is half baked, and the combination of the 2 is what makes kings. Of course style is important, but I would rather see 10000 throwups by a writer that I respect than some corny art school shit.
I started writing in 1984 and did most of my getting up between the years of 1990 and 1994. Gave it a rest until 1999 and did some more damage until around 2002. Since then I've been on hiatus but I'll always be a writer. It's the type of shit that never leaves you.
style and relentlessness go hand in hand in the making of a thoroughbred, and one element without the other is half baked, and the combination of the 2 is what makes kings
I kinda like the art part of it. Do you really get pleasure from seeing the same ugly ass throw up a billion times? To say it's ALL about fame isn't really giving Graf very much credit IMO.
to most hardcore writers, fame is the name of the game. And to answer your question, yes, seeing throw ups a billion times makes me feel warm and fuzzy (AYO) because crushing the streets is, to me, the purest part of graffiti.
And to echo Delay, the more people that write in your area and the more crushed the streets stay, the more impressive it is to be known amongst all of that madness. Dudes like Skuf and JA put in unimaginable amounts of work putting their name up and people recognize that. That's what the real graff game is about. Most writers show respect to true style and all that, and some of the street's hardest writers have amazing style (Rime and Setup, for instance), but most real street writers could give a fuck about a 20 color mural on a legal wall. It's a little different out west though, as the dudes that paint the streets the most also have amazing style and also paint lots of legal and permission walls and they just basically kill everything. I'm talkin AWR, MSK, OTR, TKO, etc. In the East it's more about throw ups and tags and stuff like that because New York, for instance, is just so covered with graff that you waste your time painting intricate pieces because somebody's just gonna go over it with a fill the next day or two.
I kinda like the art part of it. Do you really get pleasure from seeing the same ugly ass throw up a billion times? To say it's ALL about fame isn't really giving Graf very much credit IMO.
when you live in a half ass city with a few toyish tags here and there, it's pretty easy to get fame. But in a city where EVERYONE writes, and the saturation itself takes on a whole new life, it's pretty impressive when someone is able to stand out in quantity. Remember, graffiti is all about being under pressure. That's where stylish throwups and tags came from.
i have more to add...
We also come from a generation where kids know 100x more corporate brands than types of plants. That's a fact. Is it any surprise that they would want to create their own brand?
I started writing in 1984 and did most of my getting up between the years of 1990 and 1994. Gave it a rest until 1999 and did some more damage until around 2002. Since then I've been on hiatus but I'll always be a writer. It's the type of shit that never leaves you.
style and relentlessness go hand in hand in the making of a thoroughbred, and one element without the other is half baked, and the combination of the 2 is what makes kings
That's all I was trying to say.
I reread it, and i see where you say "I kinda like the art" part it was in response to Delay, but I missed what you were saying. I just can't stand it when dudes are like "I like it when they do PICTURES but the rest of it is just ugly"
I kinda like the art part of it. Do you really get pleasure from seeing the same ugly ass throw up a billion times? To say it's ALL about fame isn't really giving Graf very much credit IMO.
No offense, but that sounds exactly like what someone who doesn't really understand this game would say.
who are you responding to? the fame? or the art? if you're saying that style and creativity aren't crucial, then
I wrote from age 12 til I got caught red handed in 2001. do I not understand the game? style is major. and a punk attitude is also neccesary. I would do it just as much just for the thrill of doing something wrong as I would for getting fame.
I was responding to Pony I think, but style and relentlessness go hand in hand in the making of a thoroughbred, and one element without the other is half baked, and the combination of the 2 is what makes kings. Of course style is important, but I would rather see 10000 throwups by a writer that I respect than some corny art school shit.
Got into the freight scene real quick. I really don't have many photos from the earlier part of my career, except for the shit that was in On The Go and the videos and shit.
End to End from 1999.
A quick freight by me and Kemos.
MSP Crew car (my end. You can't see Cense, Kemos and I think Dasar)
[graff is ALL ABOUT FAME and nothing else. While I could give 2 shits about the splasher or obey, the fame element that they seek is the purest part of what they do in relation to graffiti. Graffiti was never really that difficult to begin with, just because it's more mainstream now than it was in the 70s doesn't make it less interesting or less credible. Just because you can walk into a store and buy the markers I used to spend hours making in the basement doesn't mean that everybody who uses that marker lacks credibility.
However, I agree that a good portion of graff is lame, but that's always been the case. There's always been toys. But toys grow up to be kings, everybody starts somewhere, and the game is just a little more advanced now.
I don't think that graffiti being more mainstream makes it less credible, but it makes it more accesible to millions of kids who will rep it without the cred that it merits, which was my point before. When I'm walking around in the city seeing thousands of throwups or tags most of them fail to stand out, which totally defeats the point of graffiti. And this gets back to what I was saying earlier, because if you have graffiti where there's never been graffiti before (death) it's gonna be powerful, but if you have graffiti on top of graffiti no one notices it unless it is: A.) huge in quantity (like the dude JA that was mentioned), B.) huge in quality (like that daim stuff, or something like mear1), or C.) totally different.
The thing is that because graffiti has been around for a minute now, and because styles can be found archived in books and webpages, and the tools can be bought in graffiti stores, it makes being original way tougher. I think originality is a big part of graffiti too; nobody likes a biter. Wild Style was originality, now it's pretty much status quo. To me there is a kind of, "Okay, what will it do next," thing in graffiti that needs to be resolved.
This is the homie from Canada. He paints trains and walls, and I think that this is pretty sick shit.
Comments
JA, that's another killer. Dudes like that are on some real grimey graff shit, all tags and throw upas and straight letters. That was nuts how he dissed that Saber river piece. So many heads were emotional over that one!! That's what graff's all about. I got a lot of respect for Saber but dissing something on that level takes some massive cojones!
VERY
Before JA:
After JA:
Some Skuf:
I'm definitely feeling elbowtoe, straight line mean streaks.
sorry, but you sound completely
graff is ALL ABOUT FAME and nothing else. While I could give 2 shits about "the splasher" or obey, the fame element that they seek is the purest part of what they do in relation to graffiti. Graffiti was never really that difficult to begin with, just because it's more mainstream now than it was in the 70s doesn't make it less interesting or less credible. Just because you can walk into a store and buy the markers I used to spend hours making in the basement doesn't mean that everybody who uses that marker lacks credibility.
However, I agree that a good portion of graff is lame, but that's always been the case. There's always been toys. But toys grow up to be kings, everybody starts somewhere, and the game is just a little more advanced now.
I kinda like the art part of it. Do you really get pleasure from seeing the same ugly ass throw up a billion times? To say it's ALL about fame isn't really giving Graf very much credit IMO.
No offense, but that sounds exactly like what someone who doesn't really understand this game would say.
i have more to add...
We also come from a generation where kids know 100x more corporate brands than types of plants. That's a fact. Is it any surprise that they would want to create their own brand?
who are you responding to? the fame? or the art? if you're saying that style and creativity aren't crucial, then
I wrote from age 12 til I got caught red handed in 2001. do I not understand the game? style is major. and a punk attitude is also neccesary. I would do it just as much just for the thrill of doing something wrong as I would for getting fame.
It ain't hard to get fame where I live. I understand the game of "getting up", I just really like the artistic side of Graf more, that's what attracted me too it when I was young (not to mention the rush involved when doing a piece!). I just think there's more to it then "fame", if it wasn't then people wouldn't hate on dudes like the "Splasher".
I was responding to Pony I think, but style and relentlessness go hand in hand in the making of a thoroughbred, and one element without the other is half baked, and the combination of the 2 is what makes kings. Of course style is important, but I would rather see 10000 throwups by a writer that I respect than some corny art school shit.
I started writing in 1984 and did most of my getting up between the years of 1990 and 1994. Gave it a rest until 1999 and did some more damage until around 2002. Since then I've been on hiatus but I'll always be a writer. It's the type of shit that never leaves you.
That's all I was trying to say.
to most hardcore writers, fame is the name of the game. And to answer your question, yes, seeing throw ups a billion times makes me feel warm and fuzzy (AYO) because crushing the streets is, to me, the purest part of graffiti.
And to echo Delay, the more people that write in your area and the more crushed the streets stay, the more impressive it is to be known amongst all of that madness. Dudes like Skuf and JA put in unimaginable amounts of work putting their name up and people recognize that. That's what the real graff game is about. Most writers show respect to true style and all that, and some of the street's hardest writers have amazing style (Rime and Setup, for instance), but most real street writers could give a fuck about a 20 color mural on a legal wall. It's a little different out west though, as the dudes that paint the streets the most also have amazing style and also paint lots of legal and permission walls and they just basically kill everything. I'm talkin AWR, MSK, OTR, TKO, etc. In the East it's more about throw ups and tags and stuff like that because New York, for instance, is just so covered with graff that you waste your time painting intricate pieces because somebody's just gonna go over it with a fill the next day or two.
Delay on point!
Flicks or you're SOFT!
I reread it, and i see where you say "I kinda like the art" part it was in response to Delay, but I missed what you were saying. I just can't stand it when dudes are like "I like it when they do PICTURES but the rest of it is just ugly"
Spoken like a true soldier!
Very refreshing to have a Graf thread on the SS, very good looks.
Hell yeah.
Don't make me pull it, man...
Some shit from way back...
End to End from 1999.
A quick freight by me and Kemos.
MSP Crew car (my end. You can't see Cense, Kemos and I think Dasar)
these are late 90s, but i got MUCH earlier ones. they're just not scanned.
I don't think that graffiti being more mainstream makes it less credible, but it makes it more accesible to millions of kids who will rep it without the cred that it merits, which was my point before. When I'm walking around in the city seeing thousands of throwups or tags most of them fail to stand out, which totally defeats the point of graffiti. And this gets back to what I was saying earlier, because if you have graffiti where there's never been graffiti before (death) it's gonna be powerful, but if you have graffiti on top of graffiti no one notices it unless it is: A.) huge in quantity (like the dude JA that was mentioned), B.) huge in quality (like that daim stuff, or something like mear1), or C.) totally different.
The thing is that because graffiti has been around for a minute now, and because styles can be found archived in books and webpages, and the tools can be bought in graffiti stores, it makes being original way tougher. I think originality is a big part of graffiti too; nobody likes a biter. Wild Style was originality, now it's pretty much status quo. To me there is a kind of, "Okay, what will it do next," thing in graffiti that needs to be resolved.
This is the homie from Canada. He paints trains and walls, and I think that this is pretty sick shit.